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Dave Hartley [00:00:05]:
Hi. This is Dave Hartley. And when I’m not enjoying live music, I’m listening to John Garrett on What’s Your “And”?.

John Garrett [00:00:16]:
Welcome to episode 6 33 of what’s your and. This is John Garrett. And each Wednesday, I interview a professional who, just like me, is known for a hobby or a passion or an interest outside of work. And to put it another way, it’s encouraging people to find their “And.” Those things above and beyond your technical skills, the things that actually differentiate you when you’re at work. It’s the answer to the question of who else are you beyond the job title. And if you like what the show’s about, be sure to check out the award-winning book. It’s on Amazon, Indigo, Barnes and Noble book shop, a few other websites.

John Garrett [00:00:48]:
All the links are at www.WhatsYourAnd.com. The book goes more in-depth with the research behind why these outside-of-work passions are so crucial to corporate culture. And I can’t say how much it means that everyone’s reading it and writing such great reviews on Amazon. Thank you so much for those. And, more importantly, changing the cultures where they work because of it. And, if you want me to read it to you, that’s right. This voice reading the book. Look for what’s your end on Audible or wherever you get your audio books.

John Garrett [00:01:14]:
And please don’t forget to hit subscribe to the podcast so you don’t miss any of the future episodes. I love sharing such interesting stories each and every week, and this week is no different with my guest, Dave Hartley. He’s a partner with Anders CPAs and Advisors in Saint Louis and the host of the But Who’s Counting podcast. And now he’s with me here today. David, thanks so much for taking time to be with me on What’s Your “And”?.

Dave Hartley [00:01:36]:
Thanks, John. Looking forward to it. Episode 633 is gonna be the best, I think.

John Garrett [00:01:40]:
This might be the last. Who knows?

Dave Hartley [00:01:42]:
Like We’re bringing down the house from here. Okay.

John Garrett [00:01:44]:
This is it. Like, bring it all down. Like, this is awesome. I mean, I like the numbers, 633. It’s kinda neat that they add up and whatever. I don’t know. It seems nice. So I’ll do some rapid fire questions, get to know David out of the gate here.

John Garrett [00:01:56]:
So, maybe we’ll start with that one. Do you have a favorite number?

Dave Hartley [00:01:59]:
I do. 17 is my lucky number. It’s my birth date, and then also as a kid, if you remember Jim Hart on the Saint Louis Cardinals, his number was 17. So yeah. So 17’s always been my thing.

John Garrett [00:02:09]:
Okay. Very cool. I like it. I think that might be a first for the show, so that’s good. How about a favorite cereal of all time?

Dave Hartley [00:02:16]:
Favorite cereal of all time. That’s tough. It’s between Golden Grahams and Captain Crunch. Oh, wow. So I’m kicking it old school on the cereal, but as a kid, those were like the when you splurged on the fancy cereal, you got those

John Garrett [00:02:28]:
too. Yeah. No. Those are good choices. How about, rain or snow?

Dave Hartley [00:02:32]:
Oh, winter is my 4th favorite season.

John Garrett [00:02:35]:
Oh, there you go. It might be 5th for me. Yeah. Like, it’s just

Dave Hartley [00:02:38]:
Snow is not gonna make it. Rain’s not much better, but I’d have to go rain, I guess. I could make something good out of the rain.

John Garrett [00:02:43]:
Well, especially in Saint Louis because it’s more sleet. It’s not often snow with that mix.

Dave Hartley [00:02:48]:
Yeah. If it is snow, it turn yeah. It turns to slush in a couple hours, so it’s like, what’s the point?

John Garrett [00:02:53]:
Yeah. I hear you on that one. Do you have a favorite movie of all time?

Dave Hartley [00:02:57]:
Several Christmas classics, but probably Ferris Bueller’s Day Off.

John Garrett [00:03:01]:
Oh, yes. You

Dave Hartley [00:03:01]:
can watch that a million times.

John Garrett [00:03:03]:
That’s a great movie. It really is. It’s so good. How about, your favorite activity in gym class, like, when you were a kid?

Dave Hartley [00:03:11]:
Favorite activity in gym class? That would have to be bombardment.

John Garrett [00:03:14]:
What is that? Well, it’s I

Dave Hartley [00:03:15]:
guess it’s the legal name for dodgeball. Okay. So you line up at both ends of the gym and they give you volleyballs and you throw them at each other and Yeah. Yeah. It’s like the best thing ever. That or when you’re younger, the whole parachute thing where you get into the parachute and that yeah. I I have no idea what that was for. Like, why did we do that as children? But we did.

Dave Hartley [00:03:36]:
And so it it would have to be one of those 2.

John Garrett [00:03:38]:
It’s for all those times at Andrews where you guys have parachutes running around the office.

Dave Hartley [00:03:43]:
I may have to initiate that at some point.

John Garrett [00:03:45]:
Right?

Dave Hartley [00:03:46]:
That could be a differentiator for us.

John Garrett [00:03:48]:
It really could. It’s part of the recruiting process. Do you know how to do the parachute? And they’re like, what?

Dave Hartley [00:03:53]:
I wonder how many people are listening to this going, what are they even talking about? Like, did they stop doing that, like, 2 decades ago? I have no idea.

John Garrett [00:04:00]:
Right? How about, Star Wars or Star Trek?

Dave Hartley [00:04:04]:
So Star Wars is fantastic, but for me, it’s gotta be Star Trek. And not the ones that came later, but the original. So in small town Illinois, when you came home from school, from 3:30 to 4, there was like either Brady Bunch or Gilligan’s Island, but then at 4 o’clock to 5 was when they showed Star Trek. And so after school, that was a fixture for many years. So I watch it now. My kids will, catch me watching Star Trek.

John Garrett [00:04:29]:
Classic. A classic. Super old school. Do you

Dave Hartley [00:04:31]:
know what happens in this episode? Spock does this and this, and my kids think I’m insane.

John Garrett [00:04:36]:
And, like, the special effects and everything at the time was, like, groundbreaking.

Dave Hartley [00:04:40]:
Mind blowing. Mind blowing.

John Garrett [00:04:41]:
Right? And now it’s mind blowing. That was the thing. That’s great. I love it. Your computer, more PC or Mac?

Dave Hartley [00:04:47]:
More of a PC guy, but I do embrace the Apple ecosystem for the iPhone and the iPad and all that stuff. But I just

John Garrett [00:04:53]:
Everything else.

Dave Hartley [00:04:53]:
Yeah. I haven’t switched over yet to do the main thing.

John Garrett [00:04:56]:
Oh, no. Totally understandable. How about, pens or pencils?

Dave Hartley [00:05:00]:
Probably pens because you can do different, colors and sizes and that kind of stuff. So the variety of pens is why it would be attracted to pens.

John Garrett [00:05:08]:
No. That’s a solid answer. Most people are like, I haven’t written anything in so long. How about, chocolate or vanilla?

Dave Hartley [00:05:15]:
Depends on the day, but generally chocolate. I mean, vanilla is vanilla. So, I mean, gotta spice it up

John Garrett [00:05:20]:
a little bit. The name. I mean, it’s right there. Like, it’s kinda got, it needs a PR, person to help fix that up. Oh, this is a fun one. Toilet paper roll. You go over or under?

Dave Hartley [00:05:30]:
Is that a question? It’s over. Do you actually have people that answer that question and say under?

John Garrett [00:05:36]:
Cat people, honestly. Like, for real.

Dave Hartley [00:05:38]:
Oh, because they do the thing and they pull it I guess.

John Garrett [00:05:40]:
Yeah. Or little kids, maybe. Okay. I don’t know. I just like to throw it out there just to see how aggressively over people are. Some people are changing it. Like, if they see it at a friend’s house, they’re like, no. We’re That’s

Dave Hartley [00:05:51]:
that’s we’re not we’re not doing that.

John Garrett [00:05:54]:
Right? That’s hilarious to me. How about talker

Dave Hartley [00:05:58]:
text? Generally text, but man, there’s a huge need for the voice connection. And it’s like, why am I doing this 20 minute text thing? Why don’t we just talk to each other and get this resolved in 60 seconds? So that would lead me to voice. So I’m okay with the convenience of text, but ultimately, it’s that human interaction. It’s the voice part for me.

John Garrett [00:06:16]:
Same here. Oh, this is a tricky one. Brownie or ice cream?

Dave Hartley [00:06:19]:
Can I have both?

John Garrett [00:06:21]:
Yes. That is the right answer. That’s why it was tricky. Yes. Okay. That’s a la mode.

Dave Hartley [00:06:25]:
Alright.

John Garrett [00:06:26]:
Yeah. Little warm brownie with the ice cream. How about a balance sheet or income statement?

Dave Hartley [00:06:31]:
I’m an income statement guy. I like looking at a period, seeing what’s flowing through. That gives me a better feel for the business than the balance sheet statement of cash flows. I’m a p and l

John Garrett [00:06:40]:
guy. How about a favorite color?

Dave Hartley [00:06:43]:
Favorite color would be red, which I know for a CPA is atypical, but it would be red for me. And I’m from Saint Louis, so you’ve got the Cardinals and the whole red thing that the Cardinals have going on. So, yeah, it’d be red.

John Garrett [00:06:55]:
Absolutely. How about a least favorite color then?

Dave Hartley [00:06:58]:
Well, I have listened to some episodes, and I gotta jump in with everybody else, which is brown. So for me, it would either be between brown or black, and black is, that’s okay. I can see appeal for that, but brown, there’s really no need for brown. Right?

John Garrett [00:07:12]:
I love that. There’s no need for this color at all other than the fact that it makes red look good. Brown always just makes other colors look good.

Dave Hartley [00:07:21]:
Yeah. It’s more of an accessory. It’s not like the thing. It’s more of a that pairs well or it’s a nice neutral tone or things like that.

John Garrett [00:07:30]:
Exactly. No. I love it. How about a favorite actor or actress?

Dave Hartley [00:07:34]:
Probably Tom Hanks. He’s been in the game for, like, decades and then, like, every year or 2, he surprises you with, like, really? He’s still around? Like I watched the auto film he did not long ago. I was like, that’s actually pretty entertaining. So I’d go with Tom Hanks.

John Garrett [00:07:47]:
That’s a great answer. The last one, the favorite thing you have or the favorite thing you own?

Dave Hartley [00:07:51]:
The favorite thing I own is my 2003 Ford Thunderbird. It’s a red convertible, and I actually got it from my mother, bought it for herself as her reward for her real estate career. And then, unfortunately, my mother passed about 3 years ago, and so it came to me. And now when I drive it, I love the convertible. We’re not doing video, but if we were doing video, you could see I’m follically challenged. So riding in a convertible is not a problem for me. So I put the top down all the time, and it reminds me of my mother. And so that makes me very, happy inside.

Dave Hartley [00:08:25]:
So it would be my 4th Thunderbird.

John Garrett [00:08:27]:
That’s fantastic. And it’s red and everything.

Dave Hartley [00:08:29]:
Yeah.

John Garrett [00:08:30]:
That’s so great. I love it. I love it. Well, let’s talk concerts and music. How did this start? Is it something from when you were younger?

Dave Hartley [00:08:37]:
Yeah. So I’ve always been into music. I I was kinda raised in a musical family. My father was actually a minister, So we went to church on Sundays and there was always a lot of music going on and that kind of stuff. So it was kind of always my thing, and then as I went into high school and college, it just sort of steamrolled from there, and now it’s a huge part of my life.

John Garrett [00:08:55]:
What was your first concert?

Dave Hartley [00:08:57]:
First concert would have been about 7th grade, and I went and saw Hall and Oates. Oh. I know. I started high. Hall and Oates at the SIU Arena in Carbondale, Illinois. And I had really bad seats, but to somebody from a small town, that was literally the most incredible thing I’d ever seen in my entire life.

John Garrett [00:09:14]:
Right?

Dave Hartley [00:09:15]:
That was part of the beginning right there.

John Garrett [00:09:17]:
Yeah. Well, it’s awesome because you were in a college town, so people were coming through. Yes. You know, you weren’t in the middle of nowhere where, like, you have to drive 2 hours or whatever to go.

Dave Hartley [00:09:27]:
And I I didn’t really realize how special that was until I got out of Carbondale and I realized, man, we had Van Halen, Whitesnake, ZZ Top, MC Hammer, sort of all these acts that came through. So I love what I do today. But man, my ultimate job was in college. I work security for concerts and for basketball games. That’s like getting paid to do, like, what you want to do, and it was a glorious thing. So that was absolutely amazing.

John Garrett [00:09:53]:
That’s amazing. Do you have any of those concerts that you remember that were just like, I can’t believe I’m doing this, or I forgot that I’m security.

Dave Hartley [00:10:00]:
So one of my best stories is actually I won’t tell you the full 3 minute version, but, basically, Bon Jovi came to SIU in Carbondale. And so I had worked my way down to now I was one of the guys on the side of the stage, sort of making sure that the bigger guys on front, you know, did their jobs and guarded the rail and that kind of stuff. So, basically, long story short, a fraternity pledge jumped the barrier, got on stage with Richie Sambora, and I was the last line of defense. So I had to go on stage, grab this kid, and start to drag him off the stage. He panicked and started rabbit punching me. And the lights come up after Wanted Dead OR Alive. So there’s 10,000 people watching me get beat up on stage with Bon Jovi, like, 10 feet over there looking at me. I got this kid.

Dave Hartley [00:10:43]:
We got to the side of the stage. The roadies came, pulled us out together, extracted me, and this was a long time ago, but they proceeded to, you know, harm this young gentleman.

John Garrett [00:10:54]:
Well, let him know not to do this again.

Dave Hartley [00:10:55]:
Yeah. So the to the point that they ripped his denim, and I’d never seen denim rip.

John Garrett [00:10:59]:
Oh, wow. That was something. Yeah.

Dave Hartley [00:11:00]:
But then after that, I got to hang out with first, I went back out on stage and and made sure my friends saw me so they knew I wasn’t dead. And then after that, I got to guard the dressing room, which was really super cool because I met Bon Jovi at the time, like, 2 weeks after this, he married his high school sweetheart. And I met her, and she was just kind of this normal person, and she was so sweet and so nice, and then that was a great experience. And then 2 weeks later, they got married, and I was like, that is really cool.

John Garrett [00:11:27]:
Yeah. That’s awesome, man.

Dave Hartley [00:11:29]:
And I got paid for that. Can you believe this? Right. It was amazing.

John Garrett [00:11:34]:
That’s crazy.

Dave Hartley [00:11:35]:
Another highlight was ZZ Top, which, by the way, are the nicest people on the face of the earth. I got to guard the green room with ZZ Top, and I ate little ham sandwiches and drank Perrier, and I got paid for it, in addition to watching basketball, which I’m a huge fan of. So that whole thing was, like, you know, the pinnacle of my life, I think, was at that point.

John Garrett [00:11:53]:
That’s ama I don’t know why you ever left.

Dave Hartley [00:11:55]:
I don’t know either.

John Garrett [00:11:56]:
Be, like, the head of that. Like, it’s but that’s incredible, man. I love that. That’s so awesome. And just to hear, like, how lit up you get, you know, like, and how excited. Like, if this was a a podcast about p and l’s, maybe a little bit excited, but not as much.

Dave Hartley [00:12:11]:
Not ZZ Top level. No.

John Garrett [00:12:12]:
Right. Right. Well, I mean, ZZ Top level of anything is really I mean, that’s a lot. I mean, there’s a couple of z’s in there. It’s not just z top. It’s z z top. You know? I mean, come on now. But I think that’s awesome.

John Garrett [00:12:23]:
And do you feel like any of, like, your music fandom translates to work at all? Is this something that you share?

Dave Hartley [00:12:31]:
Yes. I do. And, actually, behind me, you can see I’ve got a record on the wall signed by Joe Walsh. And so kind of a friend of the family kind of thing, and so Joe’s a great guy. So, yeah, this whole thing’s been significant for me. And, actually, the thing where it really clicked, where my worlds collided was so I came up in public accounting, and then once after you make manager, when you make senior manager, they’re like, okay. Magically now, go sell. And I’m like Right.

Dave Hartley [00:12:56]:
I have no idea what to do and so I’ll figure this out.

John Garrett [00:13:00]:
For 8 years, don’t talk to anyone and don’t look anyone in the eye and then the next day, boom, go sell.

Dave Hartley [00:13:06]:
Yeah. Go bring in new work. So as part of that, part of what as I started doing this, I’m just like, well, what do I care about and what do these people I’m talking to care about? And I’m like, I’m gonna find out. So it’s almost, John, your what’s your end concept that, you know, I deployed by basically going to talk to people and saying, well, what music do you like? What bands are you into? And they would tell me. Sometimes it was Broadway and sometimes it was different things, but that gave me a personal connection with them. They learned something about me. I learned something personal about them. So I would find out that the controller at this company was an Earth, Wind and Fire fan.

Dave Hartley [00:13:39]:
And then guess what? The next time Earth, Wind and Fire came through Saint Louis, I would give them a call or shoot them an email and say, hey, they’re coming back. Do you wanna go to the show together? And so using that as my end, basically, I developed a lot of great relationships that not only sold work, but also were very meaningful and, you know, at the end of the day, some of those relationships have been around for a couple of decades, and I still either go to shows or correspond with people because we have that thing in common and we know that about each other, and so on that level, we really connect.

John Garrett [00:14:11]:
That’s incredible. I mean, because it’s people that you end up caring about.

Dave Hartley [00:14:15]:
Mhmm.

John Garrett [00:14:16]:
And they care about you. I mean, all because you both care about the same thing, you know, music and concerts, and then but then it grows from there, and that’s incredible. I mean, it it’s literally that easy.

Dave Hartley [00:14:27]:
But I will say though, a kind of a a corollary to that was so in the 19 nineties, I started out doing CPA stuff and doing audit, and I did that for a while. And I’m like, I gotta do something different. So I started doing technology audit. And so when I did that, I joined the Information Systems Audit and Control Association, known today as ISACA.

John Garrett [00:14:45]:
Oh, okay.

Dave Hartley [00:14:45]:
But in the nineties, I started going to these lunches. And what I found was they were horrifically boring. Like, I would sit there for an hour. There’d be some presenter. Nobody at my table would talk. And so I did this for about 6 months. And finally, I said, I can’t take this anymore. I’ve gotta be the instigator.

Dave Hartley [00:15:04]:
So, well, I took it upon myself to when we would have one of those lunches. We’d sit down, try to get some small talk going, and then I’d pose a question. Who’s seen a recent movie? Has anybody seen this? Has anybody seen that? To force people to talk. And then what I found was they all responded, but somebody had to be the instigator. Somebody had to prompt them. And once I prompted them, then I made tons of friends and these were super cool people. But on their own, they just would have sat there and not necessarily engaged. So there is a bit of a risk taking that comes with when you really start sharing yourself and opening up, you do have to put yourself out there.

Dave Hartley [00:15:41]:
And I think when I look back over my couple of decades career, I think that’s been one of the things that has really helped differentiate me is that I am willing to do that, and I am willing to share about myself and go first, and then see what I can draw out of other people and how I can make them better. And then through that, just naturally good things happen.

John Garrett [00:16:01]:
That’s so perfect. I mean, that’s it. That’s what’s your hand all right there. You’re a living, breathing example of it. And the thing that’s interesting about it is I would venture to say that, you know, when you put yourself out there, you take that leap every single time you got caught. Like, I mean, you’re I mean, you were in good hands. Like, you you reached the net. You didn’t fall to your death of, like, ah, that was embarrassing.

John Garrett [00:16:22]:
Like, no one goes, no. Who goes to movies? You know, like, it’s it’s not like you asked some, like, super taboo illegal thing. It was, did you see this movie or what concert did you go to last or, you know, just something like that. And every single time you throw that out there, it reciprocates. The universe has to have the balance and so people do that. And for some reason in our heads, all the negative self talk, all the bad things, all the, you’re gonna fall on your face, you’re gonna get fired, you’re gonna never be able to work anywhere ever again. It’s like, what? Yeah.

Dave Hartley [00:16:52]:
And Get

John Garrett [00:16:52]:
out of here.

Dave Hartley [00:16:53]:
And John, you you kinda came from my era as well. So in the nineties in public accounting, there wasn’t a lot of individuality. There was not a, hey, that guy’s got long hair. That’s cool. There wasn’t that. So there was definitely in the nineties, there were a lot of suits and ties, which my kids think is fantastic that I wore a suit and tie to work every day. And there was not sort of you fit the mold and it was not encouraged to not fit the mold. And I will say that’s one of the things when I talk to younger professionals today, it’s like you gotta realize how far this profession has advanced.

Dave Hartley [00:17:24]:
And I know, John, you’re on a mission to take it even to the next level, but just in the 3 decades that I’ve been around, where we were versus where we are today is so much better, so much more open, so much more accepting. But you’re right, there is this whole other level that we’ve got to unlock that in order to get the next generation of people into the profession, we’ve gotta show them that not only is it is it a great living and it’s it’s fun work, but also you can be yourself, and it’s a natural thing for you to do. You don’t have to pretend to be anybody else. You can just be yourself, and I think that’s a huge opportunity for us.

John Garrett [00:17:58]:
Well, like because, I mean, who else can you be? And, you know, this applies to accounting, engineering, law, finance, like, consulting. That’s what’s so sad about it. It’s not just one profession. It’s all white collar nerds. I mean, we all are guilty of this. We hide behind the degree and and those certifications and the letters after our name. And it’s like, what’s the first part? The human side of you in that whole trying to fit the mold. Like, I look back on it.

John Garrett [00:18:25]:
I’m like, there’s no one that fit the mold. It was like we’re all trying to be this stereotypical thing that no one actually ever was, like, maybe in the history of ever. It’s like chasing this boogeyman, this this, like, fictitious thing, and no one stops to go, hey. What are we doing? Who’s actually fit in this weird odd shaped box? You know, why are we doing this? Just go build your own box and do your own thing, you know, and then you’re so much more effective. I mean, you wouldn’t be a partner at an awesome firm like Anders if you’d fit the mold. I mean, you just wouldn’t. And so I I think it’s awesome and it’s so cool to hear this. And how much is it on the organization to create that space or how much is it on the individual?

Dave Hartley [00:19:09]:
Well, I think it’s both. And I think as firm leaders, we have to create an environment and a culture where this is not only accepted, but encouraged and same type of thing that I was doing in the nineties by asking people, what movies have you seen lately? When I start a meeting, there’s 5 minutes of of just interacting and how are you doing. And, and I think the other thing, another key point of this is, is it does have to be genuine. If you’re asking this stuff and you’re just doing it to have the 5 minutes of interaction on your agenda, as opposed to you really care about these people, that’s a huge difference. Because for me, it’s genuine. I am honestly fascinated by people. And when I see the things that they do, the things that motivate them, and it, you know, I’ve got a guy, he loves tractor pulls and he goes to tractor pulls with his kids and he thinks it’s the best thing ever. I mean, I’ve got all these different people with the different things that make them tick.

Dave Hartley [00:20:00]:
And I think as a leader, you have to, both as a firm leader and then as an individual, you have to reach out, you have to make those connections, and then you have to appreciate that stuff. It’s not necessarily something that I would enjoy, but for that person it’s cool. So when I ask about the tractor pool and how was it and what did your son think and that kind of stuff and, you know, we now have a connection. I know that’s his and that he really loves tractor pulls. And I think that’s a job as a as a leader is to find out the ands of all the people on your team and then use that to connect with them. And I think that’s growing increasingly difficult with remote work because it’s so easy to just be transactional in remote work. Hey, I got this question. Answer it for me.

Dave Hartley [00:20:41]:
And you’re just constantly doing this transactional stuff. We actually have meetings and retreats where the focus primarily is relationships and interaction. Every Monday, we’ve got a 30 minute meeting. All of our remote is our virtual CFO practice. So there’s 70 people and we all get together and there’s a half hour and the agenda is what’s the joke, somebody’s got a topic of the day, what’s going on, and there’s all these things to get the socialization aspect, which I think is so key to people feeling really engaged and feeling like they are connected and really part of a team.

John Garrett [00:21:15]:
Yeah. No. I love that so much, man. That’s exactly it. It’s just being genuine. I care about you. We hired the whole you, not just the accounting technical skills, whatever your job is, side of you. We hired all of you.

John Garrett [00:21:31]:
So, you know, let’s nurture and shine a light on and celebrate and be excited about that. And, yeah, tractor pulls are incredible, man. I’ve been one and I’m there’s some things that you just can’t unsee and a tractor pulls one of them where you’re like, this is crazy.

Dave Hartley [00:21:44]:
I have not yet personally experienced one, but maybe someday I’ll go with him and then I can experience the joy of the tractor pull myself.

John Garrett [00:21:51]:
I tell you what, tractors can tear denim. I’ll just tell you that much. Like that’ll be they’re tough. It makes you wanna buy a tractor, to be honest. Like, they should sell them on the side. Yeah. I would have bought one. I mean, you know, they’re a couple hundred grand, but or whatever it is.

John Garrett [00:22:04]:
They’re impressive.

Dave Hartley [00:22:04]:
Yeah. With financing, you would have been in.

John Garrett [00:22:07]:
Oh, yeah. Totally. I’d still be paying for it.

Dave Hartley [00:22:08]:
Yeah. Over 62 years.

John Garrett [00:22:10]:
Yeah. Right? No. But that’s such great advice, man, and such words of wisdom to leave people with. I feel like before we wrap this up, it’s only fair that I turn the tables since I rudely peppered you with so many questions at the beginning to make this the David Hartley podcast. So I’ll be on the hot seat. Thanks for having me on. And, whatever you’d like, I’m all yours.

Dave Hartley [00:22:31]:
So one of the things the listeners may not know is that you actually originally started working in Saint Louis, Missouri, which is where I’m from. Yes. And actually now I’m in the building where you started your career in, which is crazy small world type stuff. So when you were in St. Louis, I know you did the comedy thing. What were the things that you loved to do in Saint Louis? What were the things that you really man, if I could go back and do that again today, I would do it in a heartbeat.

John Garrett [00:22:55]:
Yeah. Well, when I was there, I mean, Ted Drew’s custard is, I mean, I’m an ice cream. That’s definitely one of my hands. Ice cream custard is

Dave Hartley [00:23:02]:
That’s like the peak of the mountain right there. So yeah.

John Garrett [00:23:04]:
It really is. The hill, Italian food, also good. Soullard was fun, but in a, like, also things you can’t unsee. It’s the 2nd largest Mardi Gras.

Dave Hartley [00:23:14]:
Just happened a couple weeks ago. Yes.

John Garrett [00:23:16]:
Yeah. Exactly. And, I mean, Cardinals baseball, always awesome. Blues hockey, I was there when it was, like, Chris Pronger and MacInnis and Grant Fuhrer and Pavel Demetra and, like, pre strike. That was always fun. Like, you know, Blues Red Wings, Blues Black Hawks, man, those are games were awesome. And, SLU’s soccer, that was fun. Forest Park is nice.

Dave Hartley [00:23:36]:
Yeah. It’s a pretty amazing space.

John Garrett [00:23:38]:
I mean, the arch is cool, but it’s, like, I don’t know. Once you go up, it’s, like, I

Dave Hartley [00:23:42]:
love it. Once you’ve ridden in the little cars all the way to the top and you’ve looked out, it’s, like, that’s cool, and people should go and should see it, but there’s so much more to the Saint Louis area besides that.

John Garrett [00:23:51]:
Yeah. In Riverfront, I mean, for concerts, my first concert was there, like, so many great shows there. Like, it’s awesome.

Dave Hartley [00:23:58]:
2nd question. So of all the types of comedy that you could do, what is your favorite? Is it, man, if I could do stand up every day, I would love to do it, or is it the podcast, or is it the what is your number one choice of

John Garrett [00:24:10]:
your comedy? I mean, stand up’s the best. It’s live. It’s immediate, and it’s just you, and you’re out there. You know, if you do improv or things like that, you have a team and you have, you know, people, and, you know, you’re getting the suggestions from the audience of, you know, name something in a garage or whatever. And so the audience is already on your side because, oh, he said oil can. That’s my word. And so, the stand up is very much the opposite of, you know, make me laugh. Alright.

John Garrett [00:24:39]:
And so, yeah. And it’s great because it’s immediate. I mean, the laughter is immediate and so is the silence. And so you learn quickly.

Dave Hartley [00:24:47]:
That’s actually my third and final question, which is what is your worst flop in stand up? Like, do you have a memorable set where it just didn’t work and no matter what and you walked what was that for you?

John Garrett [00:24:59]:
Well, one was a corporate event for real estate agents. And when you start out with a joke about how all of their headshots are 30 years old and done at glamour shots. That didn’t work? No. Because that’s all of them. So it’s like

Dave Hartley [00:25:16]:
Okay. So you started by offending the audience is the lesson I think you learned.

John Garrett [00:25:21]:
I thought it was funny because it’s like Oh, it is funny. Let’s be honest. We all know it. Right? Exactly. And then there was a show I did in Indianapolis when I lived there. I was emceeing and it was a Wednesday through Sunday. It was a long week. And the show, I think it was at, like, 6 or 6:30.

John Garrett [00:25:39]:
Like, the sun was still up.

Dave Hartley [00:25:41]:
Hard to be funny when the sun is up.

John Garrett [00:25:43]:
Yeah. And, like, comedies at 6:30 PM, like, it’s just but it’s a weeknight. So alright. And there were maybe 20, 25 people there. And so I went out, started the show, and I I did a joke that I had just written, like, that day or whatever. I did, like, I started with a real joke and then I did this one second just to be like, oh, let’s throw it out there, whatever. And a guy right in the front goes, Nice try. And when there’s only 25 people, everyone heard it.

John Garrett [00:26:09]:
So, I have to address the situation. And I said, you’re celebrating something, or what brings you out on a Wednesday? You know? And he goes, I don’t celebrate anything. I have cancer.

Dave Hartley [00:26:22]:
Yeah. How do you recover from that?

John Garrett [00:26:25]:
I don’t even know. Divine intervention steps in without even skipping a beat. I literally go, is cancer what made you an a hole, or have you been like that all your life? Like and the 2 comedians in the back of the room fell off their chair. I heard them hit the floor. Like, they were like, oh, my goodness. That’s unbelievable. He’s like touche. And then we went on and the rest of the show was amazing.

John Garrett [00:26:49]:
It was one of those where I said it and I was like, that was my voice. Uh-oh. I didn’t even know it was happening. It was pretty awesome. But then, you know, once you live through that, it’s kinda like putting yourself out there on the networking tables or whatever. And it’s like worst case scenario, I’m gonna go up here for 15 minutes or 30 minutes, and no one’s gonna laugh at a single thing. And that’s never happened. That’s never gonna happen.

John Garrett [00:27:12]:
But worst case scenario second worst case scenario, I’m gonna do a couple of jokes that no one gets or no one laughs at or whatever. And then I’m gonna live to tell another day, and I’ll rewrite it and come back another day. And it’s all good. The fear that so many of us have that is just ingrained in us from I don’t know if it’s from school or society or what, but it’s like, you know, you’re gonna be okay. Just give it a shot. Why not?

Dave Hartley [00:27:35]:
And I do think that’s a key thing, which is you never lose as long as you don’t give up. You just gotta keep going. And this is a marathon. You know, I’ve been in this game for over 3 decades now. It’s definitely a marathon, not a sprint. I’ve made a ton of mistakes along the way. You just gotta keep going. So if you tell a joke, it doesn’t land, go back, rewrite it, go to the next one.

Dave Hartley [00:27:55]:
Same thing in your career. You just gotta keep going, making yourself better, and striving every day.

John Garrett [00:28:00]:
There you go, man. I love it, David. Thank you so much. That’s so perfect way to end. Thank you for being a part of What’s Your “And”?.

Dave Hartley [00:28:06]:
You bet, John. I have enjoyed it.

John Garrett [00:28:11]:
Yeah. And everybody listening, if you wanna see some pictures of David at some concerts or maybe connect with him on social media or check out the podcast, be sure to go to www.WhatsYourAnd.com. All the links are there. And while you’re on the page, please click that big button, do the anonymous research survey about corporate culture, and don’t forget to check out the book. So thanks again for subscribing on Apple Podcasts or whatever app you use and for sharing this with your friends so they get the message that we’re all trying to spread that who you are is so much more than what you do.