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Nicole DeRosa [00:00:05]:
My name is Nicole DeRosa and when I’m not teaching Zumba fitness, I’m listening to John Garrett on What’s Your “And”?!

John Garrett [00:00:10]:
Welcome to episode 689 of What’s Your “And”?! This is John Garrett. And each Wednesday I interview a professional who just like me, is known for a hobby or a passion or an interest outside of work. And to put it another way, it’s encouraging people to find their and those things above and beyond your technical skills, the things that actually differentiate you when you’re at work. It’s the answer to the question of who else are you beyond the job title. And if you like what the show is about, be sure to check out the award-winning book. It’s on Amazon, Indigo, Barnes and Noble Bookshop, a few other websites. All the links are at www.whatsyourand.com he book goes more in depth with the research behind why these outside of work passions are so crucial to your corporate culture.

John Garrett [00:00:57]:
And I can’t say how much it means that everyone’s reading it and writing such great reviews on Amazon. Thank you so much for those. It’s ridiculous how those matter and more importantly, changing the cultures where they work because of it. And if you want me to read it to you, that’s right, this voice reading the book, look for what’s yous. And on Audible or wherever you get your audiobooks. And please don’t forget to hit subscribe to the podcast. You don’t miss any of the future episodes. I love sharing such interesting stories each and every week.

John Garrett [00:01:22]:
And this week is no different with my guest, Nicole DeRosa. She’s a director of tax at SKC & Co. And a brand ambassador with UWorld Accounting. And she’s out of New Jersey and now she’s with me here today. Nicole, thanks so much for taking time to be with me on What’s Your “And”?.

Nicole DeRosa [00:01:38]:
Thank you for having me excited to be here.

John Garrett [00:01:40]:
This is gonna be a blast. It was so cool meeting you at the New Jersey Society of CPAs Convention and Expo or I don’t know, it’s got a long name but the annual.

Nicole DeRosa [00:01:51]:
Conference down in Atlantic City. Down in Atlantic City, exactly.

John Garrett [00:01:55]:
No, it was a blast. So it’s cool to have you be be a part of this. And I always start with 17 rapid fire questions, things I didn’t ask in person cause it would have been awkward. So I thought, well, let’s make it for everybody to listen.

Nicole DeRosa [00:02:06]:
What do you got? What do.

John Garrett [00:02:07]:
Okay, here we go. Favorite color?

Nicole DeRosa [00:02:09]:
Blue.

John Garrett [00:02:10]:
Oh, okay. Solid. There you go.

Nicole DeRosa [00:02:11]:
Basic blue. Yep.

John Garrett [00:02:13]:
Yeah. Yeah, that works. How about a least favorite color?

Nicole DeRosa [00:02:16]:
Ooh, white. Cause I feel like it’s boring. I don’t know.

John Garrett [00:02:20]:
Okay. Yeah, there you go. Yeah. How about a favorite activity in gym class when you’re a kid?

Nicole DeRosa [00:02:26]:
Oh, gosh. Gym class. Definitely not soccer, because it involved running. I would say kickball. No, not even kickball. I don’t know, like a scooter thing. Like, you know how you had, like, the racing scooters on the ground, like, across the gymnasium floor and you shimmy your butt? Like, that was probably. I don’t know if that’s considered really an activity.

Nicole DeRosa [00:02:45]:
That’s. That’s.

John Garrett [00:02:46]:
It’s part of gym class. Like, elementary school gym class was crazy. Even high school, like, it’s just, like, crazy.

Nicole DeRosa [00:02:52]:
I’m aging myself with these things because I don’t exist anymore. I feel like, oh, they.

John Garrett [00:02:57]:
They have to. It’s just like, we’re not hanging out with fifth graders, so, you know, it’s like, you know, like. So. Yeah, I mean, you’re, like, climbing giant ropes and.

Nicole DeRosa [00:03:04]:
Nope, not even at all. Not bad.

John Garrett [00:03:06]:
When you touch the top, you got, like, a little shock, and it was like, is this okay? Like, are we supposed to do this?

Nicole DeRosa [00:03:12]:
Yeah. I never. I never reached the top. My upper body strength is not. It’s fine. I just cheered on. I just cheer people on from the ground. It’s fine.

John Garrett [00:03:20]:
There you go. Hey, that’s. Everybody needs that, too. That’s fantastic. How about a favorite actor or an actress?

Nicole DeRosa [00:03:27]:
Ooh, I would have to say Julia Roberts is definitely. Probably, like. And Sandra Bullock. They’re, like, classic, I feel.

John Garrett [00:03:34]:
Yeah. Oh, yeah. No, they’re great. Absolutely. How about toilet paper roll?

Nicole DeRosa [00:03:37]:
You go over or under the flap is over. Definitely. I’m an over girl.

John Garrett [00:03:42]:
Over. There you go. How about socks or shoes?

Nicole DeRosa [00:03:45]:
In what? In what regard?

John Garrett [00:03:48]:
However you want to take it. Like, I just love this one.

Nicole DeRosa [00:03:51]:
I mean, I fold my socks. I don’t know.

John Garrett [00:03:55]:
Okay. All right.

Nicole DeRosa [00:03:56]:
I like sneakers. Sneakers over heels. But I do. I do like a solid wedge.

John Garrett [00:04:02]:
Okay. All right. So it sounds like you’re more shoes. Like, you know, socks are. Eh.

Nicole DeRosa [00:04:06]:
Oh, if it’s either or.

John Garrett [00:04:07]:
Shoes matter.

Nicole DeRosa [00:04:08]:
Yeah, we’ll go with shoes.

John Garrett [00:04:10]:
Yeah, yeah. No, it sounds like you care. How about Star wars or Star Trek?

Nicole DeRosa [00:04:14]:
Neither. I’ve never watched either one of them.

John Garrett [00:04:17]:
Totally fair.

Nicole DeRosa [00:04:18]:
You could judge me. You could judge me.

John Garrett [00:04:20]:
Not at all. Not at all. That works. How about your computer, PC or a Mac?

Nicole DeRosa [00:04:24]:
PC?

John Garrett [00:04:25]:
Yeah, same.

Nicole DeRosa [00:04:25]:
The whole Mac. I can’t get on board with the whole like red light, green light, 1, 2, 3. Top corner thing. It just. I don’t know.

John Garrett [00:04:32]:
Yeah, yeah. How about a favorite movie of all time?

Nicole DeRosa [00:04:35]:
I mean, anything dancing related? So I would say, like. Well, actually, how to Lose a guy in 10 days is pretty good too.

John Garrett [00:04:42]:
That’s a funny one.

Nicole DeRosa [00:04:43]:
Let’s see. Save the last dance. That was always a good one.

John Garrett [00:04:45]:
Okay.

Nicole DeRosa [00:04:46]:
And step up. Those were good.

John Garrett [00:04:48]:
Yeah, totally. You’re like replaying it in your head as we’re talking about.

Nicole DeRosa [00:04:51]:
I’m just dancing in my mind right now, you know?

John Garrett [00:04:53]:
Yep. How about you travel a ton. So do you like planes, trains, or automobiles?

Nicole DeRosa [00:04:58]:
I could pass out. I’m good. So I would say an airplane because I can go further faster. Trains, not so much cars. As long as I could pass out and be a passenger princess, I’m fine. I’ll drive as long as there’s no traffic. If there’s traffic, forget about it. But yeah, I would say.

Nicole DeRosa [00:05:15]:
I would say airplane over airplane.

John Garrett [00:05:17]:
Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. I’m a huge ice cream junkie. Do you go in a cup or in a cone?

Nicole DeRosa [00:05:22]:
Oh, in a cone with rainbow sprinkles. Flipped over into a cup so you don’t lose out on any of the sprinkles.

John Garrett [00:05:28]:
There you go. That’s some next level stuff right there.

Nicole DeRosa [00:05:30]:
I take my ice cream very seriously.

John Garrett [00:05:32]:
Yeah, I was gonna say it sounds like ice cream could be an and. That’s some next level answer right there.

Nicole DeRosa [00:05:36]:
It’s my second and that’s good stuff.

John Garrett [00:05:38]:
I like it. I like it. How about. Do you have a favorite animated character? Disney character? Anything animated.

Nicole DeRosa [00:05:43]:
I mean, I always liked Pluto because.

John Garrett [00:05:45]:
Oh, yeah.

Nicole DeRosa [00:05:46]:
I mean, I’m a huge animal lover, so Pluto was always kind of a fave. Goofy was just funny. But aside from, I would say the traditional Disney characters, there’s really no animated kind of character that I’m fond of.

John Garrett [00:05:58]:
No, no, that works. Pluto’s. Solid answer. Absolutely. How about a balance sheet or income statement?

Nicole DeRosa [00:06:05]:
I would say the income statement.

John Garrett [00:06:07]:
All right. Yeah. Well, you’re a tax person.

Nicole DeRosa [00:06:10]:
Yeah, that’s. Yeah. Balance sheets to me is like all the bookkeeping and write up work. I’m like, yeah, pass on that, but.

John Garrett [00:06:16]:
There you go. Do you have a favorite number?

Nicole DeRosa [00:06:18]:
Favorite number 27. Because, I mean, it’s my birthday, so.

John Garrett [00:06:22]:
Oh, well, then that works. We got two more. Pen or pencils.

Nicole DeRosa [00:06:26]:
Ooh, pens all day. You don’t get as much smudging on your hand with pens. I feel like with pencils you have that smudge on your hand.

John Garrett [00:06:33]:
Yeah, yeah. Plus no mistakes. You’re just like. I’m just right.

Nicole DeRosa [00:06:36]:
No, no, I white out on top of it.

John Garrett [00:06:38]:
Oh, okay. All right.

Nicole DeRosa [00:06:40]:
I’m an anal. I’m very, like. I’m very anal and, like, perfectionist in that regard. It’s white out all day.

John Garrett [00:06:46]:
White out. There you go. Okay. All right. And the last one, the favorite thing you have or the favorite thing you own, and it can’t be your white out. That’s gotta be something else.

Nicole DeRosa [00:06:53]:
Can it be my cat?

John Garrett [00:06:54]:
Oh, yeah, totally. Your cat. What’s your cat’s name?

Nicole DeRosa [00:06:57]:
Crazy cat lady. Her name is Madison. She’s 14, and I rescued her from the shelter when she was a baby. Baby. And yeah, now she’s a senior citizen.

John Garrett [00:07:06]:
That’s amazing.

Nicole DeRosa [00:07:07]:
She’s like a dog. She comes when I call and she’ll, like, literally cuddle like a dog. It’s. It’s great because she goes to the bathroom, basically walks herself so I don’t have to, like, you know, take her outside.

John Garrett [00:07:18]:
There you go. Right? That’s amazing. I love it. I love it. So let’s talk Zumba. And how did you get started with that? How did you go from butt scooters in elementary school to Zumba today? Like, there’s. There’s clearly something happened.

Nicole DeRosa [00:07:32]:
There’s something in between. I was always involved in, like, dancing and gymnastics from a young age, and I was pretty good at it. So I basically. When we moved from our original Elizabeth to where we live now, and, well, where I grew up in Clinton, my parents were like, well, one or the other. You can’t do both. And so I went to the dancing school that was there, and I was like, oh, I don’t like this. So I ended up just kind of doing cheerleading instead. Dancing was always kind of a part of what I enjoyed doing.

Nicole DeRosa [00:08:01]:
And then after I quit cheerleading. Well, not quit cheerleading, but, you know, there was a time and a place for that. But dancing was always just something I was passionate about. I enjoyed doing. I enjoyed the performance aspect of it. And it just, you know, it was fun. And it was a great workout in itself, too. So I would say that ultimately led me to finding Zumba at the gym and then taking classes.

Nicole DeRosa [00:08:23]:
The instructor would sometimes be late or, like, have to, you know, leave class for, like, a second during to, like, go to the bathroom or whatever. She’s like, you, Nicole. Like, you know, just keep everything going. And I’m like, oh, this is weird. Okay. But I did it.

John Garrett [00:08:37]:
Nice.

Nicole DeRosa [00:08:38]:
I was like, wait, I kind of have a knack for this. So I was like, you know what? Like, I like, I’m a very goal oriented person. So the CPA was definitely a huge, lofty goal for me. As you know, I kind of went into my accounting career and I said to myself, you know, once I pass the CPA exam, I want to get licensed to teach Zumba. So that’s how it kind of evolved. And obviously one had to happen before the second. But after I passed that exam, I was licensed to be. I became licensed to teach Zumba.

John Garrett [00:09:07]:
That’s so great. Do you have any favorite memories over. Over the years of teaching or experiences that I know you’ve, you’ve had some cool ones for sure. So the ones that come to mind.

Nicole DeRosa [00:09:18]:
So I’d say earlier on it was definitely more of back in the Zumba day, I’ll say. They used to have what was called these Zumba thons and they used to have these big time Zumba instructors come and like teach a class. So I took the class of. Her name was Tanya Beardsley. She was like the Zumba, like OG Goat. And that was pretty cool. Yeah, I was in Florida once for work. And another pretty big name in the Zumba world, Betsy dipico, she has a studio down there.

Nicole DeRosa [00:09:46]:
So I ubered to her studio and took her class. So aside from that, I would say just like the fundraisers that we would have, where you would get like a whole full gymnasium just filled with people and like obviously you’re basically dancing for a great cause, whether it’s curing childhood cancer or you know, the American Heart association. Just a whole bunch of charities and just, you know, obviously raising money. And now I would say transforming, taking it to the accounting conference side has been pretty fulfilling for me just because I was able to integrate my passion into kind of my like 9 to 5, if you will. So teaching Zumba, even if it’s at 6am at accounting conferences is currently like my exciting Zumba thing.

John Garrett [00:10:30]:
Yeah, well, I mean, it’s you bringing your end, you know, it’s all of Nicole coming to this conference. Instead of just work, Nicole coming to this conference. All of Nicole’s able to come out and play.

Nicole DeRosa [00:10:40]:
And it’s funny cause I’ve kept my Zumba license active even though I didn’t have a Zumba class for a while. Cause Covid kind of, you know, shook that a little bit and transformed the Zumba and everything for anything at a gym. So we weren’t able to have classes. So I kept my license active and did some classes virtually through my employer at the time. On teams, just to kind of have that sense of community, even though we weren’t physically able to be together. Now I teach at Lifetime in Bridgewater regularly. And so I kind of came out of retirement again, if you will, on a weekly basis. But then, you know, that’s filling my cup too.

John Garrett [00:11:15]:
And you’ve interchanged Zumba and dancing because, I mean, for people that don’t know, including me, Zumba is it, is it kind of like a. I don’t know, like in my mind now, for some reason I have like salsa dancing just happening.

Nicole DeRosa [00:11:26]:
Yes. And you’re, you’re right there, you’re spot on. So it’s like Latin inspired dance fitness. So you have your salsa, you have your merengue, you have like the traditional Latin, you know, cumbia, there’s a whole bunch of them, but then there’s also a little hip hop integrated in there. And they’re just basically, you know, routines. And, you know, every week some of the routines change, but it’s repetitive enough that it’s so easy to catch on that people just naturally are easily able to follow.

John Garrett [00:11:54]:
Got it. And so then as the instructor, you’re cheering people on similar to back in the day.

Nicole DeRosa [00:11:59]:
Yeah, basically I’m telling them, you know, what steps? You know, two to the right, you know, turn, you know, basically follow me and just keep your energy up. And you can burn like 500 calories in an hour class, believe it or not. I mean, depending on your heart rate. But like, yeah, you can do hundreds of calories. And people are very surprised when they hear that because they think of, oh, you’re just dancing. It’s like, no, but you’re dancing. And if you’re doing it the right way, it’s. If the class is structured the right way, it’s basically, you know, a high, low, kind of cardiovascular, intermittent thing.

John Garrett [00:12:31]:
Full body, I would imagine.

Nicole DeRosa [00:12:33]:
Oh, we squat, we do squats. We do lunges in my Zumba classes.

John Garrett [00:12:36]:
Okay. Oh, so you’re next level here. You might need to stretch. Like just listening to this. I think I pulled a hamstring. Like, this is amazing.

Nicole DeRosa [00:12:44]:
Oh, it’s fine.

John Garrett [00:12:45]:
Right? Right, that’s fine. Just power through. Power through. That’s so cool. And so do you feel like any of the Zumba or the instructor side of it translates at all to work?

Nicole DeRosa [00:12:55]:
I mean, I would say yes, because I love teaching, whether it’s a tax technical topic or a non technical topic. So teaching a fitness class versus teaching and speaking per se, there’s a lot of similarities because you’re still Kind of having to be engaging and leading a group, whether it’s they’re following you or not, you’re still kind of teaching. It’s just a different type of teaching. So I would say that definitely there’s a parallel between, you know, the accounting stuff and then the Zumba stuff, because you are essentially, you’re still performing in either way, whether it’s getting on a stage or training your staff in a conference room or whatever it is, you’re still having to kind of be in the spotlight, if you will, and get people or get the participants excited enough or keep them engaged enough to want to learn or want to do what you’re doing. So that’s definitely a parallel for sure.

John Garrett [00:13:46]:
Is there a mindset sometimes where you’re in the middle of class, you’re like, man, I don’t know if I’m gonna make it to the end of the class. And I’m in the middle of busy season. I don’t know if I’m gonna make it to April 15th. Like, I don’t know, type of thing. Does any of that carry over?

Nicole DeRosa [00:13:58]:
I mean, there’s definitely been times when I’ve been teaching my Zumba classes and I’m like, ooh, I put way too many high songs next to each other and now I can’t even bre. I just kind of. In my mind, I slow down and I kind of just take a couple breaths and like, I might, you know, in between songs, I might kind of stall a little bit just to kind of slow things down. But that’s similar to like Tax Season, you know, we always. It’s. It’s non stop, right? But at the end of the day, you have to balance it somehow. You have to take a step back, take a couple deep breaths. You know, maybe, you know, during tax season, I love to do my work thing, go to the gym, take a mental break, and then I’ll do a round two because I’ll be fresh.

Nicole DeRosa [00:14:34]:
And like, for me, that works, but it’s all about the balance and figuring out what that balance is.

John Garrett [00:14:39]:
Have you always been like that? You know, having that. That side of you, or was it. Was there a No, I gotta just bury myself in work side.

Nicole DeRosa [00:14:47]:
Hindsight’s always 20 20. And I would say in my earlier career, it was definitely not remotely as balanced as it currently is. I’ve learned along the way through trial and error, which, I mean failure. We hate it, but it’s great because we learn from it. And I would say that, you know, at first I was, you Know, a little stu trying to, you know, work in all these crazy hours because I knew I had to, but I didn’t know what it was like to, you know, take that step back and set a boundary and balance things and then you kind of learn a little bit and learn what works for you, learn what doesn’t work for you. So now, I mean, nothing’s ever perfect because, I mean, there’s always going to be an evolution, there’s always going to be a next. But I would say for, you know, I’m pretty comfortable and happy now with my balance. I’ve took a long time to kind of figure it out.

John Garrett [00:15:36]:
Yeah, and you’re not alone in that either. You know, that’s. That’s a very common response that I get from people that I ask. And does it come with confidence that, like, hey, I’ve been doing this work long enough that I’m done trying to all in on this, or is it just, you know, that. And that human side of us is just done sitting on the sidelines and is like, hey, you gotta put me in, like, this is it?

Nicole DeRosa [00:16:01]:
Well, I feel like a lot of people aren’t necessarily aware of their. And sometimes until they’re told, I just was doing it because I enjoyed doing it. Like teaching Zumba, taking Zumba, going to the gym, having that, you know, fitness element to me was kind of like my safe haven of like a brain break, if you will. Like, it cleared my mind, it helped with my stress levels. I would also argue it helped with time management because it was kind of my time to maybe, you know, if I’m on the elliptical trainer, I’ll look at emails and I’ll catch up on emails or like maximize my time, but definitely something that I feel like everyone struggles with and it’s okay to struggle. And I think that it’s not necessarily out there enough that it’s okay to struggle to find that balance.

John Garrett [00:16:46]:
As long as you’re taking steps on that path, then you’re doing the right thing, you know, and, and that’s where a lot of, you know, when I speak, it’s. It’s wild when, you know, people come up after and they just feel like I’ve given them permission to human, which.

Nicole DeRosa [00:17:00]:
Is crazy if you think about it. It’s like you have permission to be yourself.

John Garrett [00:17:03]:
Yeah, exactly, exactly. But it’s almost like we’re all on this, this merry go round on the playground, like that fast one where like everyone’s sitting on there and I mean, it’s amazing. Kids aren’t Just flying off. Like, no one wants to go that fast. And some people are feeling like not well. And then no one says, hey, can we just stop the ride? Like, why are we on this? Like, this is even make sense? And that’s where I come along and just sort of just stop and be like, hey, do you guys all want to be on this? Or like, what’s up? And a lot of times, oh, I didn’t know there was an option.

Nicole DeRosa [00:17:35]:
Well, that’s just it too. I feel like it’s a lot of, you know, the tone at the top and there’s a lot of companies out there that don’t. I’m trying to say this the right way politically, but there’s a lot of companies that almost don’t welcome people bringing their whole authentic selves to the workplace. Because it’s like, yeah, you come into the office or you come to work, you do your job, you leave. And it’s like you. But what about all the extra stuff? What about the human element of it? Like if you are engaging with your staff, if you are engaging with your people who are your biggest assets and you are finding out about what they like to do. Yeah, obviously it’s important what your clients like to do because there’s that kind of personal aspect to it. But if you are engaging with your staff, they are inherently going to be more motivated to work harder because they like you and you care about them.

Nicole DeRosa [00:18:23]:
So it’s almost kind of like, why wouldn’t employers want to have their people bring their whole authentic self to the workplace? Like it’s a no brainer.

John Garrett [00:18:33]:
Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, you hired the whole person. You know, why do you only care about 10 to 15% of who that person is? You know, the work part, there’s a whole 85, 90% of them that you don’t even know exists. And some of these leaders don’t even care.

Nicole DeRosa [00:18:50]:
It exists and it shows and it shows.

John Garrett [00:18:53]:
Yeah, it’s alarming. It’s crazy. And it’s because I think it’s harder to manage a bunch of individuals than it is a bunch of associates. Because if you have a bunch of tax associates, well, I can treat you all the same. I can say the same thing to all of you. And you’re all the same to me. And it’s almost like you’re all in the Marine boot camp, you know, and we all shave your heads and we could wear the same camouflage and just you’re all the same to me. And, you know, the minute that you start to see them all, all as individual humans, then as a leader, it’s a little bit more work, but it’s so much more fruitful and profitable and just everything’s better in that space, you know? And also, too, if a leader has an and and say maybe something they’re not amazing at, hey, I’m brand new to Zumba.

John Garrett [00:19:43]:
That’s my thing that lights me up right now. Then, you know, if you’re a senior associate, then you’re allowed to be the alpha over the partner in that relationship. When you’re talking about Zumba, that’s a great leader, though.

Nicole DeRosa [00:19:55]:
The leader shows a little bit of vulnerability or like a little bit of, hey, I’m not the best at everything. That’s okay, right? That’s normal.

John Garrett [00:20:03]:
Exactly.

Nicole DeRosa [00:20:03]:
Okay.

John Garrett [00:20:04]:
The issue is, is that there’s a lot of people that have just buried their ants. The human side of them, it’s gone dormant, if not extinct, and they accidentally are still around. So they become promoted and they’re leaders now. And so then when you’re new, that’s what you think success is, and you start to model that behavior.

Nicole DeRosa [00:20:23]:
It’s funny because I was on a panel at aicpa, engaged with Mike Max, and he actually said, you don’t need permission to be awesome. And I was like, oh, snap. That completely just resonated with me. Like, you are absolutely right, and it’s so true. Like, you shouldn’t feel bad about bringing your authentic self or you shouldn’t necessarily be shy. Like, when I first started, I mean, the whole Zumba thing in the accounting profession didn’t really happen overnight. It happened. Yes.

Nicole DeRosa [00:20:51]:
With COVID I was like, let’s do it. A team Zumba class. And it grew every single week until, at the time, people over in, like, India were taking it in different time zones. We were leaving the link open for 24 hours, and it was getting over a hundred people on a weekly basis. And I was like, oh, I’m onto something here. Like, people want to feel a sense of community. And then, you know, started, okay, well, let’s do Zumba at the NJCPA convention. Or, hey, let’s do a, you know, Wellness Wednesday Zumba class outside when the weather gets nice.

Nicole DeRosa [00:21:20]:
And just kind of thinking outside the box and being confident and comfortable enough to kind of present those ideas is what enabled me to kind of integrate my passion into my nine to five. And I mean, as an accountant, we think outside the box all the time. So, I mean, getting creative isn’t foreign to us. So, I mean, I would Encourage anyone with a passion to kind of start thinking in that regard.

John Garrett [00:21:42]:
I mean, as long as it’s not illegal or supertech.

Nicole DeRosa [00:21:45]:
Exactly.

John Garrett [00:21:45]:
Then what’s up? I mean, and it’s alarming to me when people are like, oh, you know, I don’t know what my and is, or I don’t have an and. It’s only work. And I’m like, well, let’s sit down, let’s have a chat.

Nicole DeRosa [00:21:56]:
What excites you? What motivates you? I mean, not that it’s a motivator, but I get excited when I see people smiling. Like when I’m teaching and people smile, I’m like, yes, I smile that much harder. And I go that much harder.

John Garrett [00:22:07]:
Yeah.

Nicole DeRosa [00:22:07]:
And I kill myself. Don’t get me wrong, by the end of class, I’m literally like sucking air. But you know, as people are leaving my class feeling energized and thanking me for a great workout, I’m like, this is pretty cool. This is pretty cool.

John Garrett [00:22:20]:
Exactly. And sometimes that happens in the tax work, but all the time it happens in Zumba.

Nicole DeRosa [00:22:26]:
Yeah. Because you’re not there for work. You’re there to, like, you know, better yourselves and have a good time and not be stressed out and just dance.

John Garrett [00:22:33]:
Yeah. And I mean, there’s a deeper part of you that needs to be fed, you know, and that’s it, you know, and let it play, let it come out, you know, and you don’t have to be even instructor level of anything. You don’t have to be any work world record breaking. You don’t have to be where people are on vacation and ubering to a studio to see you teach a class, you know, kind of OG level. It’s just something that brings me joy.

Nicole DeRosa [00:22:56]:
It’s the definition and it’s, it’s not like it’s this extraordinary thing. I mean, honestly, over the years, I really did think about kind of like retiring my Zumba side just because I, I, I have really bad hips. You would probably, you would probably never know. But I’ve actually had two hip surgeries.

John Garrett [00:23:14]:
Oh my goodness.

Nicole DeRosa [00:23:16]:
So back in 2008, 2009, I had two hip surgeries. I tore my labrums from, you know, gymnastics back in the day. I’m, I’m arthritic on both sides. My physical therapist even told me, like, teaching and taking Zumba, like, is probably not the best thing for me. But, you know, I was like, well, how can I make this work if I just listen to my body? It’s something I really love doing. I’m gonna do it. I’m just gonna figure out a way to do it. So that was, you know, another thing.

Nicole DeRosa [00:23:40]:
I definitely contemplated kind of hanging up my Zumba shoes and. And getting out of that. But I was like, no, we’ll figure it out. If there’s a will, there’s a way. We’ll figure it out.

John Garrett [00:23:50]:
I mean, that’s amazing. Like, I would love to have, like, a parallel universe where there was, you know, hey, you can’t use your fingers anymore to type numbers, so you’re gonna have to stop doing tax returns. And it’s like, well, I don’t know if I’m really gonna fight through that. I’ll figure, you know, I’ll just get a different. I’ll just do Zumba more.

Nicole DeRosa [00:24:07]:
That’s why, you know, figure out something else.

John Garrett [00:24:09]:
Yeah, Somebody tells you you can’t do Zumba, you’re like, that’s a lie. I will fight you on this one.

Nicole DeRosa [00:24:13]:
If they’re telling me I can’t do something, I’m proving them wrong. First off, it’s like a reverse psychology. If you want to. If you want something done, tell me I can’t do it, because then I will do it.

John Garrett [00:24:21]:
There you go.

Nicole DeRosa [00:24:21]:
I’ll prove you wrong.

John Garrett [00:24:22]:
That’s amazing. So do you have any words of encouragement to anyone listening that maybe they have an an and they feel like no one cares or. It has nothing to do with my job.

Nicole DeRosa [00:24:30]:
Oh, my gosh. Somebody was so. I don’t even know who this was, but it was probably in one of the other seminars I sat in at a conference. But someone said, if it’s. If it’s important to you, it’s important. And that was it. And I was like, okay. Another powerful one.

Nicole DeRosa [00:24:43]:
The small amount of words make, you know, really powerful statements. I feel like. So if it’s important to you, it’s important. And if you don’t feel like it’s important, then it’s not important. But if you feel it’s it’s important, figure out a way to integrate it. Or, like, maybe you have a co worker that is passionate about the same thing you’re passionate about, and all you need is another person, and then you have a little dupe, like a double team. If you will. Run clubs are so popular right now.

Nicole DeRosa [00:25:08]:
I feel like that’s an easy one. If you have a passion for running, I can guarantee you that there’s a coworker or somebody at your workplace that loves to run. So start going for runs after work together. Make a little run club at Your office, you know, or if you have.

John Garrett [00:25:21]:
An anti running club, I will join it. We just sit there and make fun of the runners or just have a walking club.

Nicole DeRosa [00:25:27]:
I don’t know, like something.

John Garrett [00:25:29]:
Even then I’m like, you know what, let’s do an ice cream club. Let’s just do that. I’ll eat ice cream and make fun of the runners as they’re running.

Nicole DeRosa [00:25:35]:
I mean, there might be a foodie group. I mean, like, everyone’s passionate about something.

John Garrett [00:25:40]:
No, no, you’re right. But. And even if, even if, I mean, because I did stand up comedy in Big four, so it’s not like, oh, we had a group of comedians. No, not at all. But other people could see the passion in my eyes and hear it in the tone of my voice. And while they didn’t do it, they would still ask about it and they were curious about it and they would, they would maybe come to a show or, you know, so even if you don’t do the same things, that energy is infectious. It’s like, tell me about it. All right, you know, and then, and then I know you weren’t teaching a class.

John Garrett [00:26:10]:
How did it go? Or, you know, whatever it is, it’s just having a couple of follow up questions that show, you know, I care about you Nicole, not you, tax Nicole, like human Nicole, all of you.

Nicole DeRosa [00:26:21]:
Well, you’re so right about that too. Like, the passion, the energy, like, people feed off of that. So even if they’re not necessarily like, like in the same passion element. Like, I mean, I’ve had people come take my Zumba class just because they want to see what it was all about. Because they’re like, oh, you speak so highly of it. You clearly are, you know, excitable. It gets you excited and it motivates you. So like, they were curious.

Nicole DeRosa [00:26:43]:
And even though after the workout they’re like, that was a really good workout. It’s not my thing, but that was like an awesome workout. So, like, thanks for the awesome workout. Like, I’m gonna be sore tomorrow. But, like, not my thing. But again, that was awesome. I’m glad I came. And so it’s just also like showing your other side.

Nicole DeRosa [00:27:00]:
And, you know, if people are genuinely interested in you as a person, not necessarily how good you are at your job, people will automatically kind of be almost like attracted to your. And if you will and want to kind of maybe be a part of it, whether it’s just to see it or maybe be part of it, whatever it is, like, people will naturally be drawn to it.

John Garrett [00:27:18]:
Yeah. Maybe it’s not my thing, but I’ll still ask you about it, you know, or whatever, you know, That’s. That’s such great advice. That’s awesome. Well, I feel like it’s only fair before I wrap this up, because this has been so great that I rudely peppered you at the beginning of this. So I turn the tables. We make this the Nicole derosa podcast. Hopefully it’s not a tax one because I will be a terrible first guest, but I’m all yours.

John Garrett [00:27:40]:
So whatever you have, whatever questions you have, I’m all yours.

Nicole DeRosa [00:27:42]:
So I’m curious, when did you first discover your. And.

John Garrett [00:27:47]:
Oh, so I guess growing up, my dad was in the military, so we moved every two or three years. And so when you’re the new kid. I was a pretty decent athlete, but also everybody likes the kid with jokes, so I knew a ton of street jokes and had a pretty good sense of humor and, you know, just kind of rolled with things and was overall, I think, pretty funny. Kids would say that about me, you know, I guess it was a little bit of a coping thing, but also I was just naturally good at it too. So. Yeah. But then when I started at PwC, we had a training out in Los Angeles and for a month and on Thursdays you could go to the improv in Hollywood and Whose Line is It Anyway? Was a big show at the time.

Nicole DeRosa [00:28:27]:
I remember that show.

John Garrett [00:28:28]:
So they would, yeah, they would shoot in the studio and then they would come down and they would do a live, uncensored, like 45 minutes. Not Wayne Brady, but the other guys would come and it was crazy. I mean, you’re just like hanging out with Drew Carey and like after the show, like at the bar at the comedy club, like, you’re just like, this is nuts. You know, and you know, Brad Sherwood and Colin Mochery and it just like, man, this is amazing. And then there were comedians before and after. It was like a three hour show and. And so there would be some that I’m like, well, I could be as not funny as that guy. Like, good Lord, and this is Hollywood, you know, type of thing.

John Garrett [00:29:05]:
And so I, I went to an open mic. I lived in St. Louis at the time and just went. And it just became a fun, creative puzzle for me to. To do. And then I just got good. You know, it wasn’t intentional that it becomes a job, and I don’t think that it should become your job at all. But, you know, it just organically came about, but it became an and officially because people Would ask me, so, what’d you do this weekend? You know, And I don’t think that they wanted you to really answer, apparently, because I’d be like, oh, I went to Springfield, Illinois, and won a comedy competition.

John Garrett [00:29:39]:
And they’ll be like, wait, you did what? And I’ll be like, yeah, the Funny Bone had a comedy competition. I ended up winning. And, you know, and they’re like.

Nicole DeRosa [00:29:45]:
Just casually, you know.

John Garrett [00:29:46]:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. They’re like, wait, hold on. Now I need to actually. What? And so it spread where people in the tax floor that I never even went to knew who I was, and, like, just. It was wildfire. It wasn’t wildfire. Hey, this guy’s an amazing internal auditor, and m. And a guy like, you really need him on your.

John Garrett [00:30:06]:
That wasn’t wildfire. It was my aunt that spread. And also the thing that people remembered years later, come to find out, well.

Nicole DeRosa [00:30:13]:
It’S a conversation starter, Obviously, it’s anyone’s and is a conversation starter, because it’s not the traditional, like, oh, I do tax, or I do audit.

John Garrett [00:30:22]:
And I would much rather talk about comedy than auditing any day, all day, even at a client. I mean, like, all the time. Even during my review. Even whatever. So, yeah, so, I mean, you know, that. That was how it came about. And then I realized, like. Like, was I the only one who had a hobby? Like, am I the only one? Like, because it’s easy to remember one person.

John Garrett [00:30:42]:
Like you. I remember one person. It’s the Zumba chick. All right, you know, and because, I mean, that’s your handle, so everyone knows before you get all angry at me. But, you know, like, then I started asking people, do you have a hobby outside of work? And do you tell people about it? And so many people were like, I have a hobby, but I don’t tell anyone about it. And so then it was like, all right, this has got to be a thing, because we’re all doing awesome stuff, and we. No one knows about it. And so we need to all know about it, because this is our message.

John Garrett [00:31:10]:
And so all I’m doing is just shining a light on it and bringing it out of the shadows and pulling it up on stage and being like, yo, time to shine.

Nicole DeRosa [00:31:18]:
It’s funny you mentioned my handle, because that actually started as a joke on Twitter before Twitter was X or whatever it is now. But I was. You know, Twitter was starting to get big, and I was like, oh, I should be on Twitter. What should I call myself? And, like, it was Zumba CPA chick. And then And I was like, oh wait, maybe I should start an Instagram too, because it’s not taken yet. And then I did it and I was like, oh wait, now I should probably post some stuff that’s related to Zumba and accounting and just kind of break stereotypes or at least try to. But like, that was also the evolution of that because it was a joke originally. Like, oh, it sounds cool, but is it really cool? I don’t know, like, but I love.

John Garrett [00:31:55]:
How you said, like break stereotypes. And come to find out the true stereotype is you and me. And most of the people listening is humans that do the work, that have other dimensions to who they are and hobbies and passions. That’s the true stereotype. This other whatever the heck it is is crazy and needs to go away. You know, this all work, all the time, stigmas.

Nicole DeRosa [00:32:17]:
And it’s changing, it’s changing.

John Garrett [00:32:18]:
It is.

Nicole DeRosa [00:32:19]:
It’s taken long enough to change, but the evolution has. We’re definitely seeing, in my opinion, the shift is finally happening.

John Garrett [00:32:26]:
Yeah. Oh yeah. No, we’re past the halfway point.

Nicole DeRosa [00:32:27]:
But it’s like the pendulum is.

John Garrett [00:32:29]:
Yeah, but don’t let it go back. Everybody listening, you know, to Nicole DeRosa podcast.

Nicole DeRosa [00:32:34]:
Okay, so you asked me about actresses, actors. So okay, who have you met that your favorite, I guess famous person that you have met?

John Garrett [00:32:43]:
Oh, wow, that’s a really good question.

Nicole DeRosa [00:32:45]:
In real life?

John Garrett [00:32:45]:
In real life, yeah, yeah, no, in my dreams. So many. I mean, Louis Anderson was amazing. Super funny. He hosted Family Feud for a long time. In case you’re stuck. He had the life with Louis. Cartoon, amazing stand up comedian, really, really generous and brought me along to some casino shows in the Borgata in Atlantic City.

John Garrett [00:33:08]:
When I was way too green to be doing those shows. I mean, I was held my own. But nah, I mean, I had no business doing that. Really, really nice guy and really, really funny Jay Leno. Same thing. When I first met Jay, I lived in Milwaukee and I just started doing standup and I told him, hey, you’re gonna be coming to Milwaukee in like three months. They had like, you know, billboards up for. And we were hanging out in the green room at the Comedy of Magic in Hermosa beach, just south of la.

John Garrett [00:33:37]:
And he had no clue. Cause he doesn’t know where he’s going. You know, he’s just. Cause he flies in, does the show and flies out. Yeah, yeah, he’s not even staying overnight. So suddenly it was his turn to go up. And so he runs out and he runs back, peeks his head in Tells somebody, hey, make sure John gets two tickets to my show in Milwaukee. And then runs back and goes up on stage.

John Garrett [00:33:58]:
And I was like, ah, he’s full of crap. Whatever. And then, sure enough, on Tuesday, the next week, they called and they’re like, hey, Jay, how many tickets do you want, like, for the show or whatever? And I was like, I guess two. Because how many people are gonna believe me? Jay Leno got us these days.

Nicole DeRosa [00:34:13]:
Yeah.

John Garrett [00:34:13]:
Like, I can’t have a whole row. So. Yeah, so two. And it was like, fourth row center. Like, amazing. Yeah. And he was such a great, super nice guy. He made sure to include me in the conversation, you know, and asking me, well, what clubs are you going up at? Oh, I remember, you know, Wiley’s in Dayton, Ohio.

John Garrett [00:34:30]:
Like, I did that. Is it still in this event? And I’m like, it is still in the same place. This is crazy. You know, 40 years later or whatever. So those are both probably pretty good stories. I mean, I’ve been fortunate enough to meet a lot of people, but, you know, those have been as far as, like, big, famous, and really, really cool.

Nicole DeRosa [00:34:47]:
I feel like the common theme of those two people for your interactions with them is that they took an interest in you. They did what they said, they said what they were going to do, they followed through, and they basically kind of were like an informal mentor in some regard to you.

John Garrett [00:35:02]:
Absolutely. And they remembered what it was like.

Nicole DeRosa [00:35:04]:
To be where you were.

John Garrett [00:35:06]:
Yeah. In my stage.

Nicole DeRosa [00:35:07]:
And that’s why they’re memorable to you as, like, almost like, you know, a leader. It’s like a leadership kind of qualities that are. Obviously, they impacted you totally.

John Garrett [00:35:15]:
I mean. Yeah. And I mean, you know, Louis didn’t have to pull me aside and be like, hey, that joke, don’t do that one tomorrow night. You know, type of thing. I know, like, type of thing. But also he would work with, hey, you know, how do we restructure this? Or what if we did this joke somewhere else? Where would you put it sort of a thing. So it was. Let me try to come up.

John Garrett [00:35:33]:
As opposed to him saying, okay, here’s your set. Let’s reorder this, because this joke’s in the wrong place and whatever. Instead it was, hey, how about we sit down and talk through this? And, you know, why do you put that there? And understanding through my eyes why I’m doing what I’m doing, Because clearly, I’m not going up there trying to bomb, like, I’m going up there with the way I think it’s the best and you know, when you’re an expert level something, you’re able to see it a little bit differently. But ask them, hey, why would you do this in this way? And be like, oh, I mean, it makes sense, but what if we tried it this way, you know, sort of a thing and kind of co create it together, you know, And I think a ton of professional services, you know, partners, directors, leaders, can very much take note of that.

Nicole DeRosa [00:36:17]:
I was gonna say there’s huge parallels between the lessons. Like you can take literally all of what you just spoke about and put it in the workplace.

John Garrett [00:36:26]:
Totally. So look at this. People are gonna subscribe to the Nicole DeRosa podcast while they’re at it. So thank you. Thank you so much for being a part of What’s Your “And”? and just being a living example of this and it’s so awesome. So thanks, Nicole, for being a part of this.

Nicole DeRosa [00:36:40]:
Yeah, thank you. And I hope more people start to explore their “Ands” because it’s fun.

John Garrett [00:36:49]:
And everybody listening. If you want to see some pictures of Nicole in action or maybe connect with her on social media, be sure to go to whatsyourand.com everything’s there. And while you’re on the page, please click that big button. Do the anonymous research survey about corporate culture, and don’t forget to read the book. So thanks again for subscribing on Apple podcasts or whatever app you use and for sharing this with your friends so they get the message that we’re all trying to spread that who you are is so much more than what you do.