Good morning. This is John Garrett coming to you with another episode of Green Apple Slices where every week, Rachel Fisch and I always talk through an article on employee engagement or corporate culture and things along like that — things along that, that’s not even a phrase where every Monday, Rachel Fisch and I always talk through an article that we find online about employee engagement or corporate culture. And so without further ado, I’ve made her wait long enough, here she is, the Accountants Group Leader for Canada in Sage, Rachel Fisch.

Rachel: Hey, John. How are you?

John: I’m great, except for I don’t know what words to put where.

Rachel: It’s fine, like it’s the first Monday in September, kids are going back to school, summer officially is over.

John: It’s Labor Day in the US. I shouldn’t even be working right now.

Rachel: Yeah, no, this is the quality of recording that you get on Labor Day.

John: We kick it up a notch, exactly but you had a fun trip to Vancouver I hope?

Rachel: I did and I think next week, going to be in Calgary for IPBC’s National Conference. So lots going on.

John: Oh, very fantastic. Well, found this on a blog on Christie Lindor’s blog, and it was —

Rachel: Can I just say, this is my favorite blog author of all time because my favorite chocolates happened to be his on that Lindor’s.

John: The Lindor’s, there you go.

Rachel: And so I’m kind of hoping that they’re going to sign on as a sponsor and I’m going to have buckets of free hazelnut Lindors at my door.

John: Exactly, no, I hear you. They’re all for you. But on her blog, she wrote “People Do Not Quit Companies, Managers or Leaders – They Quit Organizational Cultures” and here’s why.

Rachel: To me, this appealed to me because the saying has been, people don’t quit jobs, they quit managers. This is kind of taking that a little further and say, not only do they not quit managers or jobs or whatever, they actually quit organizational culture. And so a really great example is this woman named Susan who looks like they’re on a partner track and everything is looking fantastic, and out of the blue, according to her firm, she quit. Yet for her, she felt like this was a long time coming. She had finally had it. The straw that broke the camel’s back kind of thing. Because what was happening is that the organization was hiring people not consistent with their culture, instead they were hiring basically rainmakers. They’re going to bring in huge revenue regardless of how they fit within the organization, how they work with other people that whole bit, and it was really starting to change and shift in not a place that she felt comfortable in anymore.

John: Yeah, absolutely. I think that a lot of people feel like that. Things change over time and all of a sudden, you don’t fit in where maybe you felt like you once fit in whether you’re growing or the organizations growing or what have you. So sometimes that happens and she actually brought up a Harvard Business Review article where they did a study that people actually leave both good and bad bosses at almost the same rate.

Rachel: Yeah, because there’s other element on, right?

John: Right, absolutely. She goes on to say that organizational culture basically, the quote is ecosystem mash up of values, beliefs, underlying assumptions, symbols, rituals, attitudes and behavior shared by the group of employees and then it’s driven by leadership. So it’s kind of everything. It’s the intangibles. It’s the tangibles. It’s what you’re in every day. If you’re swimming in waters that you don’t feel comfortable in, then yeah, you’re going to leave.

Rachel: For sure. She then goes on to talk about five key components is that enriching out to your social media network and then talking about why do you quit jobs. She kind of dumped it into five little different buckets. One is misaligned vision and leadership, compromised values, beliefs and increased toxicity, lack of connection, appreciation, community and affinity, uncertainty during hard times and massive change, and lastly organizational structures and processes that create malaise and stagnation.

John: But it’s definitely something that is very important. I believe that if you’re having constant communication with your people and you’re genuinely interested in them and care about them, then I think that a lot of this will be nipped in the bud before it gets to be a problem.

Rachel: Absolutely. If you’re an organization where you’re seeing some feedback indicating that you’re an organization that maybe has misaligned values or you’ve got staff that aren’t feeling challenged, they might be one foot out the door a little. So take a look at that list. It’s got some good stuff on it.

John: Right, and you can see it greenapplepodcast.com. There’s a link there to the article. Don’t forget to hit “subscribe” so you can listen to all the episodes every Monday. Rachel and I get together and talk through something. Every Wednesdays, I do an interview with a different professional who’s known for a hobby or a passion or an interest outside of work. If that’s you or someone you know or work with, let me know because I’d love to have them on the show. It’d be so fun to talk through that. Have a great rest of the week Rachel and we’ll talk next Monday.

Rachel: You too, John. Talk to you later. Bye-bye.