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Bill Casey [00:00:05]:
This is Bill Casey from MGO. When I’m not playing in my band, the Brooklyn Beat, I’m listening to John Garrett on What’s Your “And”?.

John Garrett [00:00:17]:
Happy New Year, and welcome to episode 653 of What’s Your “And”? This is John Garrett and each Wednesday, I interview a professional who, just like me, is known for a hobby or a passion or an interest outside of work. And to put it another way, it’s encouraging people to find their “And.” Those things above and beyond your technical skills are things that actually differentiate you when you’re at work. It’s the answer to the question of, “Who else are you beyond your job title?”. And if you like what the show’s about, be sure to check out the award-winning book. On Amazon, Indigo, Barnes and Noble bookshop, a few other websites. All the links are at www.WhatsYourAnd.com.

John Garrett [00:00:51]:
The book goes more in-depth with the research behind why these outside of work passions are so crucial to your corporate culture. And I can’t say how much it means that everyone’s reading it and writing such great reviews on Amazon. Thank you so much for those. And more importantly, changing the cultures where they work because of it. And if you want me to read it to you, that’s right. This voice reading the book. Look for What’s Your “And”? on Audible or wherever you get your audiobooks. And please don’t forget to subscribe to the podcast so you don’t miss any of the future episodes.

John Garrett [00:01:16]:
I love sharing such interesting stories each and every weekend. This week is no different with my guest, Bill Casey. He’s the deputy CEO at MGO. And now he’s with me here today. Bill, thanks so much for taking time to be with me on What’s Your “And”?

Bill Casey [00:01:29]:
Well, thank you, John. I’m excited to be part of your podcast.

John Garrett [00:01:32]:
This is gonna be awesome. You’re a living example of What’s Your “And”?, so you’re perfect for this. I love it. But I have rapid fire questions. Get to know Bill right out of the gate here. So hopefully, you’re buckled up and ready to go. Easy one, I think. Favorite color?

Bill Casey [00:01:45]:
Green.

John Garrett [00:01:47]:
Solid. I saw that coming from a mile away, but I love it. How about a least favorite color?

Bill Casey [00:01:52]:
I’m gonna have to go with purple.

John Garrett [00:01:54]:
How about your first concert?

Bill Casey [00:01:56]:
Kiss Uriah Heep, 1976.

John Garrett [00:02:00]:
Wow. That’s amazing. That’s awesome. Did you get dressed up for it, or were you just like

Bill Casey [00:02:06]:
No. The, one of my best friends, his uncle was in the, the music business, was a promoter for Capitol Records. And every major band that went through Chicago would play where the Blackhawks used to play hockey, the old Chicago stadium. So KISS and Uriah Heep were playing, and we went to the concert.

John Garrett [00:02:24]:
That’s awesome. I love that question just because there are always such great answers. Here’s a twist. How about a favorite Disney character or almost any animated character since I think Disney owns all of them?

Bill Casey [00:02:34]:
I always like Roadrunner. Ah. That’s crazy. It’s a Disney character, but I like Roadrunner.

John Garrett [00:02:39]:
No. They I’ll take it. It’s animated. I should change it to anime. Oh, that’s great. I love that cartoon. How about a favorite actor or an actress?

Bill Casey [00:02:46]:
You know, I’m gonna go with Tom Cruise, only because he’s around my age. And I always respected him probably for his physicality among everything else. The guy always stayed in really good shape. You know, he always seems to make a point in whatever movie he’s in. Even the last one I saw, running. And the guy Right. Seems to be running, you know, like an 8 second, you know, 100 meter race. So I thought, you know what? And, you know, he’s shorter than me, but I’m like, okay.

Bill Casey [00:03:11]:
I mean, this guy is in good shape. So acting aside, just as a pointer for someone who’s, you know, around my age, I’m thinking, alright, Tom Cruise.

John Garrett [00:03:20]:
I I like it. How about toilet paper roll? You go over or under?

Bill Casey [00:03:23]:
You know, I’d say I’m probably in over toilet paper roll. Yeah. Never really wanna be painted with that brush in particular, but I guess if I had to be, I’d have to say over.

John Garrett [00:03:33]:
Within arm’s reach. I’ll go with that. Right? Like, it’s just close enough. Whatever. How about a Star Wars or Star Trek?

Bill Casey [00:03:40]:
Oh, hands down. I met Bill Schachner not long ago. I gotta tell you. The man is 93 years old. He’s very much into equine sports, and I’m not gonna be able to specifically state the type of equine event that it was. But Shatner is known around the world for this particular one. He emceeded it. Then there’s probably, oh, I’d say at least, I don’t know, maybe 50 ish tables of maybe 10 people per table.

Bill Casey [00:04:08]:
William Shatner went to every single table, said hello, and then he got up and ad libbed and was hysterical for 30 minutes. This is a man who’s named before. He is as sharp as attack. I got my picture taken with him. I grew up on Star Trek. I love Star Trek. I lived in Brazil for 5 years. I told Shatner this story.

Bill Casey [00:04:27]:
A big piece of me learning Portuguese was watching episodes of Star Trek. I taped all 75 episodes of Star Trek in Portuguese. And I lived in Sao Paulo. The accent was from Rio. And I got to the point where I swore that this was really Shatner’s voice. He happened to actually speak Portuguese with an accent from Rio de Janeiro. So, yeah, I’m a huge, huge Star Trek fan.

John Garrett [00:04:52]:
I was gonna say that’s some next level type stuff. That’s impressive. Your computer, more of a PC or a Mac?

Bill Casey [00:04:58]:
Absolute PC guy.

John Garrett [00:05:00]:
PC. Same here. Same here. Do you prefer more hot or cold?

Bill Casey [00:05:04]:
You know, I think as I’ve gotten older, I’ve kind of I was generally cold. Now I’ve kinda flipped to hot. I thought about that. That’s a weird trend in my life. But, yeah, just kind of becoming self aware of it.

John Garrett [00:05:14]:
Okay. Well, this is more of an intervention podcast, apparently. There you go. You’re welcome. How about a favorite animal? Any animal at all.

Bill Casey [00:05:21]:
Oh, hands down. It’s gonna be dogs. We have 2 large Saint Bernards. I love dogs.

John Garrett [00:05:26]:
Yeah. They’re awesome. How about ice cream? I love ice cream. Do you have a favorite flavor?

Bill Casey [00:05:29]:
Pistachio.

John Garrett [00:05:31]:
Oh, okay. That’s interesting. Yeah. A little twist there. Okay. How about on an airplane? More window seat or aisle seat?

Bill Casey [00:05:37]:
Absolutely window.

John Garrett [00:05:39]:
Window. There you go. Okay. We got 4 more. Balance sheet or income statement?

Bill Casey [00:05:43]:
Wow. That’s a good one. It’s kinda weird. I I just I reflexively went towards a balance sheet, and I don’t know why. But I just someone asks your favorite vegetable, and then you just go with tomato. You know, like, wow. I’m not sure. Is that a fruit or a vegetable? I’m going with balance sheet, and I honestly don’t know why.

John Garrett [00:06:02]:
No. That that well, probably because you know when it’s done, because it balances.

Bill Casey [00:06:05]:
If I have to say which one’s more conservative, it’s balance sheet. Right? Because this is what you got. Income statement is you’ve had it. Right? It’s gone now. You had that. Now it’s gone. So I think, yeah, I think I I towards conservative, which is balance sheet.

John Garrett [00:06:17]:
I like that. Alright. How about a favorite number? Any number?

Bill Casey [00:06:21]:
Yeah. I’m gonna go with 12.

John Garrett [00:06:22]:
Is there a reason? Or My

Bill Casey [00:06:23]:
birthday. It’s 12th.

John Garrett [00:06:25]:
Yeah. Yeah. Totally. Since you’re Chicago guy what favorite toppings on a pizza?

Bill Casey [00:06:31]:
Pepperoni.

John Garrett [00:06:32]:
Pepperoni. Okay. There you go. Just simple. I like it. And the last one, the favorite thing you have or the favorite thing you own?

Bill Casey [00:06:38]:
I would have to say, so one of my many hobbies is working on cars. And in my view, I have said car, the by far, the coolest car that was ever made in the United States. And the cars that I have are cars that I built, but I made one exception. To me, the coolest car that was ever made in the United States was a 2,005 Ford GT, which is a replica of the Ford GT that won the Le Mans. That, I would say, is kind of my prized possession. And for any Ford GT lovers out there, I actually drive it. I don’t care. And I know every mile depreciates it.

Bill Casey [00:07:13]:
But you know what? So what? I don’t care.

John Garrett [00:07:15]:
That’s why you have it. That’s why I’m Exactly.

Bill Casey [00:07:17]:
I’m gonna I’m gonna drive the wheels off the thing. I take care of it. It still looks brand new. But, yeah, I’m the guy that’s running up miles on a Ford GT. Mine’s not the the 100 mile Ford GT. It’s not.

John Garrett [00:07:27]:
Right. I love it, man. That’s awesome. Yeah. And, I mean, restoring cars is definitely one of your things, but so is playing in a band. I’d love to hear more about this. Like, how did the music side of you get started?

Bill Casey [00:07:37]:
So I came from a, a a very musical family. My folks were from Ireland. You know, it’s just something as a family, mostly on my mother’s side. My mother played, they referred to as squeeze box. Granny played the squeeze box. My mother later got into more of the accordion. My sisters and I all played the piano for years years. But I was the instrument that I really wanted to play was a guitar.

Bill Casey [00:08:02]:
And a buddy that, getting back to the Kiss concert, you know, likewise, he came from, you know, musical family as well. And so, you know, we just started playing guitar together and trying to play the songs that we liked on the radio. Did that through high school. You know, unfortunately, none of us could sing. You know, I view myself as a great backup singer with the mic off. I just couldn’t sing. And so we got to college. Yeah.

Bill Casey [00:08:24]:
We met up with a couple of guys. You know, we we could sing, so we’d play like it. You know, we never got a bar gig. We tried. But there was some there’s a really good music scene at the, University of Illinois in Champaign during that area worthy of googling. We just couldn’t get a gig on our own. And then once I got out of school, started working, some other guys that I grew up with, we were in a band. We did a couple of things.

Bill Casey [00:08:45]:
Like a lot of bands, we played eighties cover tunes at parties. And we had another thing that we were doing too is people had asked us, put together a party tape. So we’d put together a party tape, and then we’d insert our songs into a party tape. That then led us into probably the greatest gig I had in my life is there is a club in Chicago where and you’re familiar with karaoke, where the music’s playing and then people sing over it. Well, the twist on this was imagine the reverse of that. So you have a YouTube song. They’re you know, obviously, very popular in the eighties. So imagine Bono singing, and then, you know, we were the band.

John Garrett [00:09:20]:
Wow. That’s fun.

Bill Casey [00:09:21]:
It was great. So you’re in a dance club in an area the size of maybe 2 phone booths. We were up in the corner, you know, cranking out the tunes, and it was unbelievable because the audience got the experience of live music and, you know, the mix that you could change with that. And then they could hear, you know, the person that was singing it. And then, you know, we would do things. We would extend every song, we could extend it as long as we wanted to. You know, longer guitar leads, longer this, longer that. So love doing that.

Bill Casey [00:09:50]:
And then my previous firm was where I spent all my career. And had bands. And when I was in the Chicago office, I was in the band. And the big event of the year was the kinda like, the summer social event. Big deal for everyone in the office. You know, well over a 1000 people. We were the band for that. And it was fantastic because then I got to meet people at work, and it was just a really neat way to meet people, different people at And you meet people through music, which, you know, I can’t think of a better way to meet.

Bill Casey [00:10:19]:
You know, you talk about songs. You talk about it’s just really great. And then, of course, the numbers that we’re playing for the event. And then piece the rest of us, we get together and we play, you know, the music that we like. One thing about a band, it’s not about playing the music you like. It’s about playing the music that the audience wants to hear. But when you get together as a band, you you always kinda carve out those moments. Okay.

Bill Casey [00:10:41]:
I like this band. You like that band, so let’s play these songs. So I did that for years. At had, you know, lots of bands over the years. Whatever city I went to, there was always a band that that we could play and, you know, traditionally, we’d play at the events. We’d play at parties. Every once in a while, we’d get, like, a bar gig, roll the tape forward. There was a band, full time band that I played with in Charlotte.

Bill Casey [00:11:02]:
I was retired fully retired for about a year. I played with several bands here in Miami. We covered the RV circuit on the West Coast of Florida, which, again, is beyond a hoot.

John Garrett [00:11:14]:
That’s awesome.

Bill Casey [00:11:15]:
Are those outdoor gigs then? Absolutely. And they’re, you know, big events. I mean, you know, you’re talking about a lot of people. And, you know, great crowds. You know, folks just wanna have a good time. And, you know, that age group obviously caters towards our sweet spot, you know, which would be eighties music. And a little bit of seventies music turned into it, but I was never the boss in these. I, you know, I was a guitar player.

Bill Casey [00:11:35]:
It was just a wonderful way to to know people and, you know, stay sharp and look. If you wanna be in a band, you gotta be in a lot of bands. So that means you need to know a lot of music, and you have to keep your, and we call them chops, your guitar skills. You have to work at it. So it’s not something that, you know, you don’t play the guitar for a month and then someone calls you. Okay. We’re playing these. Good to go.

Bill Casey [00:11:55]:
No. You have to work at it. You know, I tell you pretty much every day. If you can, you spend an hour or 2 every single day just kinda, you know, working the chops, just remembering the songs, make sure you got the leads down, and you’re flexible enough with you know, depending on who you’re playing with. If they sing a different key, you can move around with it. So, you know, it’s a great way to know people. It’s a great way to stay sharp. And I’ll, you know, look, I will tell you that and we always talk about bringing your whole self to work.

Bill Casey [00:12:20]:
And this is a big part of bringing your whole self to it. If you’re gonna play in front of an audience, you don’t get up there and screw it up. I mean, you gotta be prepared. You gotta be sharp. You gotta be on your game. And, you know, it’s really being, quite frankly, game ready. And to bring that presence to the work environment, you know, it’s critical. A lot of folks are concerned about getting in front of a group and doing a presentation.

Bill Casey [00:12:43]:
I get it. Get in front of a whole bunch of people and performing live. There’s no second take. I mean, you got one shot at getting it right. You got a lot of people watching.

John Garrett [00:12:53]:
And especially when you’re doing songs that are their favorite song. Their

Bill Casey [00:12:55]:
favorite song. You know exactly how You better nail it.

John Garrett [00:12:58]:
I think

Bill Casey [00:12:58]:
they’ll let you know. Exactly. They don’t think they know it, but they know it exactly. And if you, you know, you flub up that lead where they’re waiting for that one part where they can we can all, you know, kinda air the target and and word it. And you can see you can see the disappointment. It’s palatable. It’s like, really?

John Garrett [00:13:16]:
That’s so awesome, though. Like, I I love all of that of just, you know, from in the early days of being in this tiny space playing YouTube songs while Bono’s singing the audio of Bono’s singing. I mean, that’s such a rush. I mean, of just like, wow. Like, this is incredible. And and the audience is all in it and every all the way through to the the RV door, which is totally different gig, outdoors, which is a different animal altogether. But the band, what a great example for organizations to just create a band. I mean, the people are there.

John Garrett [00:13:47]:
If you don’t know it, then ask. And all of a sudden, you know, you’re now known to, like you said, over a 1000 people easily in the Chicago office as the lead guitarist of the band. You know? And that doesn’t hurt a career. That doesn’t hurt. No.

Bill Casey [00:14:02]:
No. Not at all. And I I would say as I obviously progressed in my career, you know, I I had folks a lot less experience than I did that were somehow another reporting through the organization, you know, up to me. And we had no shortage. In the professional services business, there are so many talented people. There’s no shortage. I remember one band that we were in, our singers were all female. And so we covered, as you’d expect, The Go Go’s, Joan Jett, Blondie.

Bill Casey [00:14:29]:
And this woman was ridiculously talented. She was the act. And, you know, I just remember in particular, talking about a U Tucson, it was a U Tucson. One particular string on my guitar, the tuning was off, and she told me that. I’m like, wow. Okay. Obviously, I gotta step up my game here. If you can hear that, because I obviously cannot.

Bill Casey [00:14:51]:
And that’s someone who was, you know, let’s say in our the hierarchy of a big firm like several layers below me saying that, how much longer are you gonna keep playing that thing? And it’s gonna irritate me because you’re playing it with a book that’s flat and you’re killing me.

John Garrett [00:15:05]:
But I love that. Like, how cool is that that then she becomes the alpha in this scenario. You know, in in the hierarchy of it’s a different scenario. You know, maybe knowledge of, you know, the accounting space or consulting or whatever the work is, maybe you

Bill Casey [00:15:19]:
you know, we had we had folks that look. I I felt the hack with these folks. We had another person in our band before they started from college, toured with the band for a year or 2. We had 2 2 people that were in bands that they went from college to playing in bands. I mean, look, I I didn’t do that. And so Right. With when you’re with people of that caliber, you know, obviously, it’s great and, you know, their their patience and their willingness to teach. Yeah.

Bill Casey [00:15:45]:
And now that’s cool to you know, your ego steps aside and says, hey. You know what? You’re actually the expert in this.

John Garrett [00:15:52]:
You know? Thank you for teaching me. Like, I’m now the student. Where when we get in the office, maybe it’s the other way around. But, you know, in this scenario, it’s the opposite. And that’s

Bill Casey [00:16:00]:
the case. That too is you also then when you reverse roll that, you can see what’s effective. Right? How you get the feedback because there are a lot of ways to give the feedback. Right?

John Garrett [00:16:10]:
Right. Oh, yeah.

Bill Casey [00:16:11]:
I know the audience here, I’ll keep it g rated, but it’s like, okay. I don’t think that quite sounded right. And, okay, you were not on the beat. It’s all about being on the beat. You know, just because you can play it, that’s great. But if you can’t play it on the beat with the band, it doesn’t matter. I’m sure it sounds great to you when you play it in your room and with your headphones on, but when you’re playing with the band, you’re way off. And just, you know, again, getting the message without demoralizing, but being constructive and moving forward.

Bill Casey [00:16:41]:
That’s the other side of it. Right? You know, the ability to see how people can give constructive feedback and do it in a way that, you know, the person appreciates the feedback and learn from

John Garrett [00:16:52]:
it. Yeah. No. And another great point you brought up is just it’s a team thing. You know? So you could be the master expert in some work topic. But if you can’t play nice with others, then that doesn’t matter. If you know everything, doesn’t matter because, you know, you’re a part of a team here. You’re part of a group.

John Garrett [00:17:09]:
You’re part of something bigger than you.

Bill Casey [00:17:10]:
No. I would say throughout my career throughout my life, there’s many, you know, analogies that I make that are music analogies or band analogies. Right? And as a band, obviously, you know, the lead singer is the most important role. Right? Then it’s the drummer, then it’s the bass, and then it’s everyone else. But yet all of us need to come together. We cannot be successful. We’re not gonna have a good show if we’re not, you know, we’re not all performing well. And what’s gonna happen in every performance, someone’s gonna forget something.

Bill Casey [00:17:38]:
There’s no magic formula, verse, chorus, verse, chorus. No. You can start with the chorus. You you can have the chorus twice and then the verse and, you know, god knows what. But inevitably, someone’s gonna miss something. Someone’s going to miss something. And, you know, how the band comes together, and no one’s gonna know that in the audience unless, you know, this is a song they’ve memorized or something. But again, it’s just, you know, working together.

Bill Casey [00:18:01]:
Alright. We recognize that if someone forgets the words, we’re not gonna sit there and look freaked out and panic. The show’s gotta go on. We’re gonna move forward, and that person’s going to catch their breath. They’re gonna find where they are, and, you know, we’re gonna move forward.

John Garrett [00:18:17]:
Yeah. Get back in gear and then just iron it out, and then we make it happen. I love that. And, like so how much do you feel, like, it matters that people have an and outside of work, hobby, passion, interest versus just all work all the time?

Bill Casey [00:18:30]:
You know, again, I I think what’s key in our business is is really having relationships with your team members. It’s always to the point where you can demonstrate that you have a personal interest in what’s important to you. You’re not trying to get to someone’s personal life, but I, you know, in addition to okay, John. You know, you’re working with us. We’re working in this part. You obviously have a passion and interest to do this work. But, you know, outside of work, what I’m always interested in is the why. You know, if your hobby is mountain climbing, what is it about mountain climbing that you’re passionate about? Tell me more.

Bill Casey [00:19:04]:
I like that story. First of all, I find it interesting to learn why you’re interested in it because then maybe I’ll become interested in it. Then now I know something about you. I can relate to you in a way beyond just work. You know, it just opens up the lines of communication and you find that this person next to you, there’s something else you can get comfortable with. Oftentimes, there’s more challenging conversations that have to be had. Having a basis beyond just talking about work, you know, it helps that. Right? But I think, you know, demonstrating that you have it goes a long way.

Bill Casey [00:19:40]:
Demonstrating to a fellow colleague that you’re working with that you have a personal interest in just who they are as a person. There’s so many elements to that, but that’s what I found. And I love talking about it. I mean, I could the number of people that I’ve given lessons to, you know, ad nauseam, only because it’s infectious. When you find someone that really, you know, enjoys a hobby, they enjoy talking about it, and they want others to experience it. And something with that, you know, if I find out this mountain climb, like, oh my goodness. I don’t I don’t know what I’ve been waiting for. Right.

Bill Casey [00:20:12]:
Maybe I’ll give that a go.

John Garrett [00:20:14]:
Yeah. You I mean, you brought up a great point, though. The critical feedback isn’t so critical. You know, it’s like pulling your friend aside and be like, hey. You can be better. You know? And where if if the only communication you have with someone is work and it’s your bad at work, then, of course, that person’s gonna get disgruntled and probably leave, and they should, you know, and find a place where people do care about you as a person.

Bill Casey [00:20:36]:
In firms, professional service firm, our firm at MGO, the gray matter in all these firms, it’s culture. And the culture isn’t just what we do for work today. The culture is, you know, how we interact, you know, as humans. The respect we have for each other. The caring we have for that. Quite frankly, part of that is just getting to know your colleagues. And again, this is not getting into, you know, personal corner, you know. No.

Bill Casey [00:21:00]:
It’s just getting to know what what do you like to do outside of work? Oh, why do you like to do that? What’s the next thing? Tell me more about that. You know, demonstrating that you have an interest in that person, you know, as a human, you know, outside of that. And, you know, what motivates you, you know, etcetera. I think that’s all part of team building, building trust within a group. And, you know, for me, look, it’s always been a big part of my identity. And I think humans communicated musically before they figured out the words. Right?

John Garrett [00:21:28]:
Right. Yeah.

Bill Casey [00:21:29]:
I think I read that somewhere about dogs. That’s why I’m going back to dogs. But I think

John Garrett [00:21:33]:
There you go.

Bill Casey [00:21:33]:
Inherently, we’re all musical. Now some of us are better than others. We all tap. You know, we all like to cheer dance, the whole 9 yards. It’s in our DNA, so it’s a really nice way to, you know, interact with people. And I love all genres of music. I I just wanna play music. And whatever you’re into, you know, pick up a guitar.

Bill Casey [00:21:51]:
We’ll figure it out. We’ll start jamming. And, likewise, if you come visit me, I’m here in Miami, I have of course, I have a band room. I’ve got everything set up. Got the mics, the drums, or whatever. If you’ve never played before, I’ll get you on the bass. I’ll get you on the drums, and we’ll start playing. Right?

John Garrett [00:22:06]:
Let’s go have some fun. They’re gonna have some fun. And and I love that you asked the even the why of you know, so it is what’s your and, but then while why that, that’s a much better story and more engaging moment than why accounting. You know? It’s like, for most people that I mean, that you know, the the story I mean, you’re laughing. I mean, you know, because it’s like, that’s a short story that I don’t probably don’t even wanna hear, But why mountain climbing? What? You know, like, yeah. I wanna hear that story.

Bill Casey [00:22:34]:
Yeah. It’s like, oh, I love numbers. What are you gonna ask me now? Right? Right. You wanna come together?

John Garrett [00:22:40]:
I I got a d in physics. I was gonna be in engineering, and I couldn’t do that. So that’s why I’m in accounting. Like, what now? You know? Like, I mean, that was my story. But I love that. You know? And it it is just getting to know the humans around you. Like, the human side of them. Because it’s much more engaging.

John Garrett [00:22:54]:
People’s eyes light up. They’re activated humans, you know, at that moment. And it’s infectious, like you said. I love that. That’s awesome. Yeah. So do you have any words of encouragement to anyone listening that maybe they already, you know, play in a band or they have a hobby that but they don’t

Bill Casey [00:23:09]:
think Look. I think it’s critical. I think, you know, just the world that we live in at times can be very stressful and challenging. It’s important. It’s important that, you know, you can, you know, fall back to hobbies. I mean, I find them incredibly therapeutic. And oftentimes, you know, music helps me relax, but also helps me think through some, you know, issues that I’m dealing at work. I feel, you know, playing music makes me creative.

Bill Casey [00:23:32]:
I think my brain just starts kinda thinking a different way to be creative, but I, you know, I could go on with, you know, all the benefits for it. But I think, look, it doesn’t have to be music. It can be, you know, a 1000000 things, dancing, something. Just putting yourself in a different environment that challenges you. Pick a hobby where there’s some opportunity to grow in that. And it’s in a way that’s, you know, you decide the pace, etcetera. But I think, you know, just to be balanced, I I think it’s very helpful.

John Garrett [00:23:58]:
Yeah. And as long as it brings you joy, then that’s all that matters. You know? And it’s probably something that’s deep in your soul that you can’t undo. If I told you you could never, you know, play music again, you’re like, well, that’s gonna hurt. And if I was like, well, you could never work at an accounting firm again. You’re like, I’ll be alright. You know? I guess you know? But, unfortunately, we get turned upside down and twisted around where the thing that really lights us up, we put aside and we say, oh, well, maybe come do it later. And then we do the other thing and it’s like, you know, you can do both.

John Garrett [00:24:28]:
And that’s why the what’s your and

Bill Casey [00:24:29]:
And you can do both. And I will tell you they complement each other quite well.

John Garrett [00:24:32]:
I love that. That’s so what a perfect way to to wrap there, and that’s so great, Bill. But I I feel like it’s only fair since I rudely peppered you with questions at the beginning that I turn the tables. We make this the Bill Casey podcast. Thanks for having me on as your first guest. So, yes, I’m all yours. Any questions you have for me, I’m on the hot seat.

Bill Casey [00:24:51]:
Well, John, what I do know about you as a, Notre Dame grad and kind of your trajectory, I’m just curious to know is, I mean, what is the message that you are sending to folks that that listen? How are you trying to change their behaviors, and what problem are you trying to solve? Let me put it that way.

John Garrett [00:25:12]:
Well, I mean, I I guess, at the end of the day, it’s creating people centered leaders that value the worker as much as they value the work. And that also value goes internally as to the listener as an individual. We value the work that we do so so much. So much so at professional services firms that we put a dollar amount per hour. You know? That’s how much we value our time in the work that we do. But it’s you know, how do we value the human? You know? You’re a human being that does engineering work, that does law, that does accounting, that does consulting. But we forget that, and we think that we are our job titles, and we are not. The job title is simply an outfit that we wear for a brief period of time in our life, and then we take it off.

John Garrett [00:25:59]:
And you’re a human before you had the job, during, and after you had the job, and we forget that so easily. So it’s really that. It’s just valuing the worker as much as you value the work.

Bill Casey [00:26:09]:
And I I will say, and and I’ll I’ll leave it at this, is that in many times, when decisions are made, communications are made, is unfortunately, what you just said is not evaluated properly. And, unfortunately, it’s a lesson we, unfortunately, we don’t seem to learn, and we repeat that mistake. Because oftentimes, had we had thought that through a little bit more, recognizing that these folks just aren’t numbers behind a certain staff level. These are human beings that have lives outside, and the ripple effects of certain decisions that are not, you know, not fully understood. And more than that too, in terms of when we decide to make certain investments, not evaluating fully the talents that we have. Recognizing that there’s a lot more that these folks are capable of doing. But, you know, we shame on us for not assessing it.

John Garrett [00:27:03]:
There’s a massive gold mine of talent at every organization that is completely untapped. You know, you being in a band, getting up and presenting in front of an audience, that’s easy for you. Like, that’s a muscle that you exercise all the time. You know, somebody that puts together a 1,000 piece jigsaw puzzles, they have a different skill set and a different expertise. That’s not gonna show up on their resume, let’s say, but that’s expertise that can be used in a certain way. Or, you know, relationships with clients, relationships with coworkers, all those things, you know, is untapped by going into the ands. You know, just who else are you beyond the job title? And it really helps for people too that as they go through their career, like, you know, they’re gonna retire eventually. So it’s like, okay.

John Garrett [00:27:43]:
You gotta go jump to something. And I think that’s why a lot of people never retire is because they’re like, I don’t know what to go jump to. And it’s like, you know, they’re they’re just gonna just work forever in their chair, I guess. And it’s like, no. No. There’s other things to who you are. And and if you forgot, well, just go back and look at it. And that’s some of the work that I do with organizations, also with individuals through the, you know, personal development coaching and and what have you is, you know, how do we create these organizations where we don’t forget? And then, you know, we can celebrate and shine a light on these.

Bill Casey [00:28:16]:
Very good.

John Garrett [00:28:18]:
Well, thank you so much, Bill, for being a part of What’s Your “And”?, and I appreciate you taking time to be on the show and, look forward to, yeah, crossing paths one day soon and coming down to your music room for sure.

Bill Casey [00:28:28]:
Alright, John. Well, thank you. I really enjoyed it.

John Garrett [00:28:33]:
Yeah. And everybody listening, if you wanna see some pictures of Bill on stage or connect with him on social media, be sure to go to www.WhatsYourAnd.com. All the links are there. And while you’re on the page, please click that big button, do the anonymous research survey about corporate culture. And don’t forget to read the book. So thanks again for subscribing on Apple Podcasts or wherever app you use and for sharing this with your friends so they get the message that we’re all trying to spread, that who you are is so much more than what you do.