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John Garrett [00:00:00]:
Hey, this is John Garrett. I’m passionate about making work more human, especially in this age of AI. I don’t just host this podcast, I also help organizations put people first. Through my keynote speaking, coaching and What’s Your “And”? implementation programs. To learn more or to connect with me on LinkedIn or Instagram, I invite you to join the movement at WhatsYourAnd.com. Now let’s jump into this week’s conversation.

Tricia Katebini [00:00:28]:
Hi, this is Tricia Katebini and when I’m not running, I’m listening to John Garrett on What’s Your “And”?

John Garrett [00:00:33]:
Welcome to episode 731 of What’s Your “And”?. This is John Garrett, and each Wednesday I interview a professional who, just like me, is known for a hobby or a passion or an interest outside of work. And to put it another way, it’s encouraging people to find their “And”; those things above and beyond your technical skills, the things that actually differentiate you when you’re at work. It’s the answer to the question of “who else are you beyond the job title?”. And if you like what the show’s about, be sure to check out the award winning bestseller on Amazon, Indigo, Barnes and Noble Bookshop and a few other websites. All the links are at WhatsYourAnd.com. The book goes more in depth with the research behind why these outside of work passions are so crucial to your corporate culture. And I can’t say how much it means that everyone’s reading it and writing such nice reviews on Amazon.

John Garrett [00:01:23]:
Thank you so much for those. It’s silly how much that matters and more importantly, changing the cultures where they work because of it. And if you want me to read it to you, that’s right, this voice, reading the book, look for What’s Your “And”? on Audible or wherever you get your audiobooks. And please don’t forget to hit subscribe so you don’t miss any of the future episodes. I love sharing such interesting stories each and every week and this week is no different with my guest, Tricia Katebini. She’s a partner at GRF CPAs and advisors out of Bethesda, Maryland. And now she’s with me here today. Tricia, thanks so much for taking time to be with me on What’s Your “And”?

Tricia Katebini [00:01:56]:
And thanks for having me, John.

John Garrett [00:01:57]:
Yeah, this is going to be so much fun. Something that I don’t do a lot of, but I know you’re really into the running so this is going to be really, really curious to hear how this goes. But I have 17 rapid fire questions to get to know Tricia on another level here. So I’ll start you out here. Your computer. You go PC or Mac?

Tricia Katebini [00:02:17]:
Oh, PC for work, but Mac for personal. So both.

John Garrett [00:02:20]:
Okay. A little ambidextrous, A little bit of both. Okay. Impressive. How about ice cream? You go in a cup or in a cone?

Tricia Katebini [00:02:28]:
Cup. I don’t like a mess.

John Garrett [00:02:30]:
That makes sense. All right, how about shoes? Heels or flats?

Tricia Katebini [00:02:33]:
Heels. A hundred percent.

John Garrett [00:02:35]:
Oh, okay. There you go. Power. How about a favorite cereal of all time? Maybe as a kid or now.

Tricia Katebini [00:02:40]:
Right now I’m really gravitating towards the magic spoon, but the one that’s like the fruity Pebbles or Fruit Loops.

John Garrett [00:02:47]:
Okay.

Tricia Katebini [00:02:48]:
Gotta get the protein.

John Garrett [00:02:49]:
It’s healthy, but also a little bit like when you were a kid. And it’s a little bit of both. That’s awesome. Yeah, I love it. How about a favorite day of the week?

Tricia Katebini [00:02:56]:
Week Friday.

John Garrett [00:02:57]:
There you go. All right. Yeah. And since you have the accounting background, I’ll go balance sheet or income statement?

Tricia Katebini [00:03:03]:
Income statement.

John Garrett [00:03:05]:
There you go. Just show me what you made.

Tricia Katebini [00:03:07]:
That tells your story. Yeah, that tells your story for the year, right?

John Garrett [00:03:11]:
Yeah. There you go. How about a favorite number?

Tricia Katebini [00:03:14]:
Seven?

John Garrett [00:03:14]:
Oh, is there a reason?

Tricia Katebini [00:03:16]:
I was born on 7 17. I weighed seven pounds, seven ounces. So it’s a seven.

John Garrett [00:03:21]:
It was from the beginning. It was like you had no choice. How about a favorite season? Summer, winter, spring, fall.

Tricia Katebini [00:03:28]:
I love the leaves. I love the changing of the season. And when we get into running, that’s also the time where you’ve trained all summer and you’re just starting to feel your power and speed.

John Garrett [00:03:38]:
Ah, there you go. And then you get results. Okay. I didn’t even think of that. That’s awesome. I love it. How about Star Wars or Star Trek?

Tricia Katebini [00:03:46]:
Star Wars.

John Garrett [00:03:47]:
Yeah, I’m same. Yeah. Yeah. I never, never got into the Trek.

Tricia Katebini [00:03:50]:
I grew up watching Star Trek, but Star Wars.

John Garrett [00:03:54]:
Interesting. All right, how about a least favorite vegetable?

Tricia Katebini [00:03:57]:
Hmm, That’s a tough one. Brussels sprouts. Yeah, it’s steamed Brussels sprouts.

John Garrett [00:04:02]:
Oh, yeah, yeah, There you go. Yeah, yeah, because if you got to roast them, you got to throw something else on there. You got to like. That’s is work. How about puzzles? Sudoku, crossword, maybe a jigsaw puzzle.

Tricia Katebini [00:04:13]:
Oh, I am a big fan of on the iPhone, the wordle. Yeah, I guess that’s New York Times. And the Quartiles.

John Garrett [00:04:22]:
Oh, I haven’t heard of that one

Tricia Katebini [00:04:23]:
on the news for our iPhone. So that’s what I gravitate. I like words.

John Garrett [00:04:28]:
Yeah, there you go, all right, how about a favorite color?

Tricia Katebini [00:04:30]:
Red.

John Garrett [00:04:31]:
Red. Interesting. How about a least favorite color?

Tricia Katebini [00:04:34]:
Purple?

John Garrett [00:04:36]:
Oh, okay. That’s curious. Because they’re cousins or half of purple is red, but it’s like, nah, yeah, it’s not going to happen. Okay, how about a favorite actor or an actress?

Tricia Katebini [00:04:45]:
That is a tough one. See, I really, really like Jim Carrey. I grew up watching all of his movies. Like, he’s. No matter where he is and what he’s doing today, Jim Carrey is just one funny man.

John Garrett [00:04:56]:
We’re best friends right now. Absolutely. He’s the greatest. He’s absolutely the greatest. And everyone I’ve talked to that has met him, he’s like the nicest guy. Like, he’s just like everything that you would imagine. Absolutely. And you don’t hear that as much because he hasn’t done a lot recently.

John Garrett [00:05:10]:
But that doesn’t matter. I mean, all this stuff. So good. I mean, so good. Let’s see here. Do you have a TV show you would binge watch?

Tricia Katebini [00:05:18]:
This is going to sound so bad. 90 Day Fiance. Any of the spin offs. Any of them. Because it’s just mindless entertainment. I can turn it on. I cannot not pay attention. I can’t pay attention. And the drama.

John Garrett [00:05:32]:
And you’re always like, well, I thought I was crazy, but I am clearly not the most crazy. I love it. That’s awesome. How about toilet paper roll? You going over or under?

Tricia Katebini [00:05:40]:
Over.

John Garrett [00:05:41]:
Oh, you said that very sternly. Like that’s. There’s a wrong.

Tricia Katebini [00:05:46]:
Apparently there is a wrong.

John Garrett [00:05:49]:
And the last one, the favorite thing you have or the favorite thing you own?

Tricia Katebini [00:05:53]:
My dog. I don’t know if you. I mean, I love my dog. I have a Bernadoodle. She’s the best. She’s so fun.

John Garrett [00:05:59]:
And what’s her name?

Tricia Katebini [00:06:01]:
Well, I guess technically have two, but I’m talking about one in particular. Her name is Roxy. She’s my puppy. So

John Garrett [00:06:10]:
in case the other one’s listening. It’s not. Not you.

Tricia Katebini [00:06:12]:
Exactly.

John Garrett [00:06:13]:
That’s awesome. Very cool. Well, let’s talk running. And how did that get started? Was it something you were doing as a kid and kept going or later in life?

Tricia Katebini [00:06:23]:
Yeah. So I guess running really started for me with playing soccer. I grew up playing soccer. And so just off season and part training, you have to run, right? Granted you’re not doing distance running, but when I got to college, it became more intense. And when I played, I played Division 3 soccer for a couple of years and they were making us run 5, 6 miles on the off season. You know, so I guess it’s always just been a part of me. And when I started and got outside of college, I was still doing. I was still active.

Tricia Katebini [00:06:51]:
I loved going to the gym. I didn’t run as much in terms of, like, distance until 2017, I think it was when I really, really got into it. My daughter was born in 2015, and it was just like, something I could easily put my shoes on when she went down for a nap and go out the door. So just became more. And. And there’s a great running community here. I have met so many of my good friends this today through my running community. So it’s just a part of it now.

John Garrett [00:07:21]:
No, that’s great. Yeah. I mean, I grew up playing soccer as well, and running in my brain never switch. It’s punishment. It’s always been because. Well, maybe it’s because I was doing that a lot. So, like, there was a lot of punishment. So, like, it’s a.

John Garrett [00:07:35]:
It became that.

Tricia Katebini [00:07:36]:
My husband feels the same way.

John Garrett [00:07:38]:
Yeah, I’ve never been able to get over that hump, but good for you. And that’s. That’s really awesome. And, you know, meeting friends and there’s a community for that and all of that. That’s. That’s really awesome. Do you have some favorite runs that come to mind that you’ve had or, I mean, tons of medals and all the things. So you’ve done quite a few.

John Garrett [00:07:56]:
Is it hard to pick one or some?

Tricia Katebini [00:07:59]:
So there are the ones that obviously come with the personal best, the personal records. Those are always great memories. They hurt during the process, but they’re always good memories. But I think some of the ones that I’ve had the most fun on are when I get to travel with my girlfriends. We go to a destination race. Like, we just recently went to Florida. We were supposed to run a half marathon and unfortunately got canceled because of weather issues. But we rented a house for the weekend.

Tricia Katebini [00:08:26]:
We had fun. We hung out by the pool. We had good food. So we just got to, you know, have our camaraderie. And that kind of thing is. I think even though it’s not a run, it’s associated with the run in the whole community that I was talking about in the beginning that I just love that, you know.

John Garrett [00:08:43]:
Yeah, it’s almost better without the lactic acid buildup and all the things. So it’s like, oh, we should just do this next time. Just fly to where it’s happening and then hang out. No, of course the run is. Is, you know, you train for it. And you build up for it and all that, but it’s still great. And. And it’s.

John Garrett [00:09:00]:
That camaraderie really is. If it sounds like that’s what feeds your soul and, you know, and fuels you, that’s. That’s really cool. That’s awesome. Yeah. And I guess, you know, does. Does this translate at all to work, all the running and all that, I mean, or, you know, whether it’s a relatability factor or a skill or a mindset or something, does it. Does it translate to the office you feel.

Tricia Katebini [00:09:21]:
I do for. For a multitude of reasons. What’s really funny is that I listen to another podcast where it was a professional one, but the woman that was being interviewed was a runner herself. And one of the things that she said was, I wish in an interview I could ask if you were a distance runner, because a distance runner is a person who will continuously move the goalpost and continuously want to improve and to get better. And when I heard that, I was like, man, that makes so much sense for me because I’m always like, oh, I finished this project. Okay. What’s the next thing that I can do to kind of put on my list and accomplish and help the firm with or whatever? So that’s one piece that’s really relatable. I think the other part of it, too, is that in my running community, we do group runs, and when we do group runs, they can be anywhere from, three people to, let’s say, 50 sometimes, depending.

John Garrett [00:10:16]:
Okay. Yeah, that’s like a motorcycle gang coming through. Like, that’s a move across the street. Like, get out of the way.

Tricia Katebini [00:10:22]:
Yes. You know, so we have fun, but we have a motto where we don’t leave people behind. So if you. If you have a pace group, you’re set with that pace group. We stay together, and we run together, even if someone falls off the pace, whatever it might be. And so when I think about that as a leader, particularly as a partner, one of the things that I’ve been working on here recently is ensuring that I’m bringing my people along with me. And so as a leader, it just kind of continues to translate. You can learn a lot from running.

Tricia Katebini [00:10:51]:
You have good days, you have bad days, you have good weeks, you have bad weeks. And all of it just translate into how much training, how much time are you willing to put into and dedicate to it. So I think it correlates a lot in different ways.

John Garrett [00:11:05]:
I love both of those examples of that. And I think, you know, during an interview, you know, asking, you know, what is it that lights you up outside of work? I think it’s fair. I’m sure some HR person is sweating bullets right now. But, like, you know, like, I think that’s a legit question because I want a human being to work with me. And if it’s running, you have a certain skill set and a mentality that maybe we need. If it’s a thousand piece jigsaw puzzles, you have a different skill set and a different mentality that we might need. But if I just see, you know, college degree and a couple of certifications, well, you’re all the same, but you’re not, you know, like, there’s a human behind you, that, that’s your actual, real skill set. The innate thing, the thing that lights up your soul, that brings you joy, like the thing that you’ll do endlessly just because.

John Garrett [00:11:52]:
And we need to know that about our people. And it’s awesome to know it coming in because then too, I mean, one thing that I love to do with organizations I work with is just, you know, what is it you would love to do outside of work and how can I help you do more of it? You know, if you have a runner on your team, but they’re not running well, then they’re not a fully activated human. And so knowing these things matters for so many reasons. I love that so much. And the, you know, leaving no one behind, you know, it sounds to me like you’re meeting people where they’re at. You’re not dragging them, you’re actually going to them and going at their pace to then get them up to yours. Is that how you would, you would

Tricia Katebini [00:12:32]:
think that that is what I’m working on? I won’t say I’m perfect at it, but that’s exactly what I’m working on.

John Garrett [00:12:39]:
You at least have that mindset, you know, so you’re aware of it. Yeah, no, it’s. It’s definitely not easy. And especially when there’s busy times or busy seasons, specifically in accounting, you like, it’s. It’s a different game, but there’s the other nine months of the year or what have you to then work up on that pace a little bit. And then, okay, now we’re humming there we go type of thing. So I love that. That’s awesome.

John Garrett [00:13:01]:
And so is the running something that you do talk about at work and share? Has it been throughout your career or more after you became a partner? You’re like, well, I guess I’m in. Now I can say what I want.

Tricia Katebini [00:13:12]:
Yeah, no, I’ve definitely talked about it all through my career. In fact, we have done some runs together as teams. We’ve done a Spartan race. We’ve done 5Ks together. We have done a half marathon. I ran a half marathon back last May with one of my other partners. So we have a community, I guess, at work too. We don’t necessarily go out and train together, but we’re like, hey, I’m doing this run.

Tricia Katebini [00:13:36]:
Do you want to join me or race? Really? So it’s. Yeah, absolutely. Talk about it.

John Garrett [00:13:41]:
And then you find that you create connections, you know, with others and. And I mean, not to say anything specific, but like, the people that you. That are also runners, I feel like you have a different sort of a relationship than you do with, you know, maybe the other partners who aren’t runners. It’s just a different kind of a relationship. Not good or bad necessarily. It’s just different. All in a good way, you know, type of a thing, I would think. And if there was a workplace where no one knew any of the.

John Garrett [00:14:10]:
And like, ugh, I would not want to work there, like, that would be terrible. Like the show, somebody told me about it and I caught it on flight. It’s called severance, where they put the chip in your head. And when you walk into work, you forget everything outside of work. And then when you leave the office, you forget everything. You don’t even know what you do for a living when people ask you. And that’s crazy, and it’s wild when I see that show that like the characters are yearning to know what they’re outside of their Audi is what they called it, their outside of work self is doing. And who am I outside of work? So, you know, the soul is once that connection.

John Garrett [00:14:45]:
Do you feel that as well? Like when you’re at work or you’re.

Tricia Katebini [00:14:48]:
Oh, I absolutely want to note. I mean, I guess not about me, but like about my people. Right. I’m always. It’s so funny, you know, in when Covid hit and we really went into a virtual mode and were on calls, people were so focused still on work and just popping on calls and going immediately to work. And I would be like, hey, let’s take a couple of minutes and just talk. Because we’re missing the in person. We’re missing being able to have like water cooler chitchat or cafe chitchat.

Tricia Katebini [00:15:19]:
So I really enjoy learning about what my staff are doing or what the people that I work with, my peers even, and what they’re doing. So, you know, because like you said, it’s the whole holistic human. We want to work with humans, we don’t want to work with robots.

John Garrett [00:15:35]:
Yeah. I mean, despite how much they’re trying to make us. You know, like, at the end of the day, AI is not human. AI doesn’t have an. And that’s AI is what you’re describing is the thing that pops on. Does work, talks, work. That’s it. And.

John Garrett [00:15:48]:
And we don’t want that. I mean, we want to be productive and we want to get our work done, but we also want to feel a connection and also feel valued ourselves and feel seen. I love that. That’s beautiful that you recognize that. And we’re like, hey, everybody, calm down. And especially in your leadership role, people are going to follow that. You know, it’s not a trap where I’m just, you know, luring you in and ha, you fell for it. Now you’re fired.

John Garrett [00:16:11]:
Like, it’s. It’s the opposite. That’s so cool. And, and I guess. Do you feel like there are ways that GRF does encourage people to have an and maybe it’s having some of these running groups or other, you know, kind of groups like that, or are there ways that the firm does that?

Tricia Katebini [00:16:27]:
Absolutely. I mean, we have a great work life balance culture that we’ve really tried to instill with our people and our staff. Like in our audit department in particular, which is where I work out of, we have summer Fridays for our staff. We actually encourage our staff to take off. We give them four hours of admin time and then they work their nine hours a day for the rest of the week, Monday through Thursday. So that’s, you know, so then they get Fridays off. And that is so they have time to go out, have time to really connect again with people and themselves. Because what we have learned is that if you are burnt out, you don’t produce.

Tricia Katebini [00:17:09]:
You just are not productive, you’re not effective. And so, you know, that’s one thing that I think is really awesome for us is that we really do try to balance life and work.

John Garrett [00:17:18]:
It’s so important. And it’s, you know, it’s even better when it’s like, what did you do with your Friday? Like, where did you. Oh, you were going on vacation. Let me see some pictures of that. Or, oh, you went to this concert. Like, I’d love to see a video or whatever, you know, like. Or you did this run. How was it? That’s, you know, kind of closing that loop of not only do we care giving you time, but we care.

John Garrett [00:17:37]:
I want to Know, like, what’s up? Like, I’d like to. And it sounds like that’s what you do accidentally anyway, because you care. And people can feel that. That’s awesome. And I guess how much do you feel like it’s on an organization to create that environment or how much is it on an individual to, you know, start it amongst their peers or jump in?

Tricia Katebini [00:17:57]:
Yeah. So I, you know, I like to think that in that world, we’re almost like lemmings sometimes. Right. So one person can start it, and then it’s the trickle effect. Everyone starts to take place. And then if it works and it is doing well and it’s creating effectiveness somehow in the organization, then that does turn into the culture, and then it becomes on the organization to continue that culture. And so I think that’s kind of where, you know, GRF is really unique, where we have built a place where people have been able to say, hey, this is who I am, this is where I work, but this is also who I am as a human. And we’ve been able to take that and continue.

Tricia Katebini [00:18:41]:
And now it is on us as a. As a firm, as our leaders to continue to make sure that that culture thrives and lives, and we give the people the space to do that. So it started out with three people in our firm. You know, as our founders, they bred that culture. So one individual turns into the whole work. I think you can start a positive role.

John Garrett [00:19:01]:
Yeah, I mean, I agree, like, because, I mean, the leader, those three could have created something. But if no one followed or if no one did it, well, then obviously that’s not going to be the culture. It just becomes three leaders that are standing out. But then, you know, once it starts, then it’s. You’re. You’re right. It is kind of a ying and a yang dance where, hey, the group has to come along, but then once they’re coming along, don’t squash it. Leaders, you know, like, so it’s this dance between encouraging it and then following and doing it.

John Garrett [00:19:29]:
And. And I love that. That’s awesome. So do you have any words of encouragement to anyone who’s listening that maybe they’re a runner, maybe not, maybe it’s something else, but they have an and that they feel like has nothing to do with their job. So why should I talk about it or share it?

Tricia Katebini [00:19:43]:
Yeah, I mean, at the end of the day, we can connect with people in so many different ways, and it’s not just necessarily about what we do at work. One of the biggest examples that I see is you Know the AICPA, which is the association for International Certified Public Accountants. Right. That organization. We have a lot of really good conferences, and we have actually created a running community at the conferences. So I have met people I would have never met because they don’t do the same thing that I do. They’re not in the same service line, they’re not doing whatever, but I’m able to connect with them. So I always say share.

Tricia Katebini [00:20:25]:
I have a lot of other smaller ands as well. And when people hear about some of those, they’re like, oh, I do that too. You know, and it kind of starts another conversation. So there’s just always something to learn and unravel. People are onions, right? Isn’t that what Shrek said?

John Garrett [00:20:43]:
Yeah, right?

Tricia Katebini [00:20:44]:
Pure onions. We have so many layers to us. You know, I’m a mom, I’m a runner, I’m a wife, I bake sourdough. I love to do all types of things, so how much more is there to me? Peel, keep peeling me back.

John Garrett [00:20:57]:
Exactly. Yeah. I mean, I like to tell people it’s like a die. Like, you know, you have dice and. And just be. You roll it, and one number is up, but the other five don’t disappear. They’re still there. So even though the work side of you is up, the runner, the sourdough, the wife, the, you know, the mom, the dog mom, like, all those parts of you didn’t dis here, you know, they’re still there.

John Garrett [00:21:16]:
And so, you know, having a leader like you that cares about these other five sides, and I need to make sure that some of those are up sometimes. Because if it’s all the work side all the time, that’s the only side that’s up ever. Then, like you said, burnout, you’re no good to you, you’re no good to us. You’re no good to anybody. And, you know, we can’t have you be like that. And it’s so trippy to me that when left to our own devices, humans will typically go that route like that, that burnout route. We will. We’ll do it to ourselves, you know, because we think that that’s how we have to be here.

John Garrett [00:21:48]:
That’s what they need us to be. Or because I’m getting paid, I should just sacrifice my soul for everything. And it’s like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. So it’s. It’s awesome that, you know, you recognize that and explicitly say, no, no, I’m not gonna let you do that type of thing. Because, I mean, it’s so wild to me. You’ve seen it where people will willingly go the burnout route on their own, and it’s crazy how that happens. So you’ve.

John Garrett [00:22:14]:
You’ve seen that yourself?

Tricia Katebini [00:22:16]:
Yes, the burnout route, Absolutely. I’ve done it myself. One of the things that I think is really unique, too, about my firm is that we actually watch hours. And if people start to work too many hours, we will actively reach out to them and say, hey, are you okay? What can we help with? Can we shift some responsibilities off of your plate? Yes.

John Garrett [00:22:35]:
So, yeah, that’s exactly it. I’ve had so many clients where I’ll say, do you have a report that comes if somebody has to. Not enough billable hours. Oh, yeah, we definitely have that report. And we go talk to them right away because you need to be working. And I go, well, do you have the opposite? You have a report where somebody’s getting too many hours? Well, why would we do that? Well, because people are getting ready to crash out. That’s why. So good for you guys for recognizing that, because that’s the most important report right there.

John Garrett [00:23:00]:
I mean, the one who’s not doing enough billable hours, you already know you don’t need a report for that. But the one that’s got too many bill bars, you probably don’t because they’re masking it. And so kudos for that. And anyone listening, that’s the report. That’s the thing you need to make sure of. Because why am I, as a leader, piling on too much? Or why am I giving you things that you’re not skilled for or whatever it is? Like, we gotta talk and figure this out. So that’s beautiful. I love that.

John Garrett [00:23:24]:
That’s so awesome. Well, Tricia, this has been so great, and you’re such a living example of this movement and for being a part of this and. But I feel like I rudely peppered you with questions at the beginning, so let’s turn this around. We’ll make this the Tricia Katabini podcast. So you’re the host, I’m your guest. Thanks for having me on. And so, yeah, whatever you want to ask. I’m in the hot seat.

Tricia Katebini [00:23:46]:
Well, John, what’s your “And”?

John Garrett [00:23:47]:
Oh, I have several as well. And it is not running. I love college football. I absolutely love college football.

Tricia Katebini [00:23:54]:
What’s your team?

John Garrett [00:23:55]:
I went to Notre Dame, so that’s definitely my team, but I just love all of college football. I’m a little sad that it’s not at all the same as what I grew up with. But it’s neat that Notre Dame’s going along with it. Like, that would be terrible if. If they weren’t, because that would just be brutal. But I love that. I love going to concerts. I love traveling all over the world.

John Garrett [00:24:14]:
I also love ice cream. So, you know, that’s an. And for sure. So all kinds of things, you know, these other dimensions of things that. That they just really light me up. And we’re going. We’re gonna go do stuff. I mean, I take my wife and my daughter to a Notre Dame game every fall because they know that that’s me living my best life.

John Garrett [00:24:32]:
So let’s go, you know, and. And it’s really great.

Tricia Katebini [00:24:35]:
What’s your favorite flavor of ice cream then?

John Garrett [00:24:38]:
Oh, wow. Yeah. Almost anything with chunks.

Tricia Katebini [00:24:41]:
The Ben and Jerry’s Chunky Monkey.

John Garrett [00:24:43]:
Yeah. Or like, you know, like a chocolate chip cookie dough or a. Like a chocolate brownie fudge chunk. Like, just seven chocolates all in the. Like, it’s just. Yeah. It Maximize the calories per spoon into my mouth. Yeah.

John Garrett [00:25:00]:
I don’t know why. Like, I mean, the regular ice cream is fine, but you get some chunks or something. Yeah. Then I don’t know why. It’s just.

Tricia Katebini [00:25:07]:
How did you know that Maryland has an ice cream trail?

John Garrett [00:25:10]:
Oh, I did not. But that is about to be on it. And so is it something that. Is it a walkable or is it more of a runnable, like.

Tricia Katebini [00:25:17]:
No, you definitely have to drive, but they have an ice cream trail and that it’s got a listing of all the creameries and shops that are unique to Maryland.

John Garrett [00:25:26]:
To go and try their ice cream is awesome. And the next time I’m there, it is definitely going to be. I’m adding it on an extra day or two for that. That’s totally worth it. Yes. That’s awesome. Very cool. One more.

Tricia Katebini [00:25:38]:
One more. Okay. Favorite type of book series.

John Garrett [00:25:43]:
So, I mean, since I was a kid, I haven’t really gotten into the fiction so much. There was a period where I wasn’t reading as much after college, kind of starting my career or whatever. But then. Yeah, I mean, my favorite book is Steven Pressfield’s the War of Art. It’s for creatives, and it just talks about how there’s, you know, this, like, inner demon that just holds us back and keeps us from creating our masterpiece, our statue of David, our, you know, whatever. And I believe that professionalism does that for us as professionals. It holds us back from living our best life, doing our running, doing our sourdough, doing our you know, these things that, you know, professionalism lies to us and tells us these things, and it’s all happening in our own mind. No one explicitly told you you can’t run, or if you do run, don’t talk about it.

John Garrett [00:26:31]:
What are you crazy? We do it to ourselves. And so that’s really what. What’s your hand is all about is just breaking through that in a similar way. I love that. I also love Eckhart Tolle’s A New Earth, that book. I think if every high school kid read that book, we would have a pretty amazing world, you know, and it’s. It’s a. It’s heavy, but it’s definitely worth the read.

John Garrett [00:26:52]:
Each time I read it, I pick up new parts because it’s got layers to it. It’s kind of like a Simpsons episode where you’re like, wait, I don’t remember. Oh, wow, okay. Like, you know, like the little Easter eggs or things. So kind of that whole side of things is a lot of the. And it also dovetails with the work that I’m doing now as well, and, you know, a deeper realm.

Tricia Katebini [00:27:10]:
Very cool.

John Garrett [00:27:11]:
So there you go. So thank you so much, Tricia, for being a part of What’s Your “And”?. This has been so much fun getting to know you. Thank you.

Tricia Katebini [00:27:16]:
Thank you.

John Garrett [00:27:21]:
Yeah. And everybody listening. If you’d like to see some pictures of Tricia at the finish line or running or connect with her on social media, be sure to go to WhatsYourAnd.com. Everything’s there. And while you’re on the page, please click that big button. Do the anonymous research survey about corporate culture, and don’t forget to read the book. So thanks again for subscribing on Apple podcasts or whatever app you use, and for sharing this with your friends so they get the message that we’re all trying to spread that who you are is so much more than what you do.