Episode 173 – Andrew Van De Beek

Andrew drinks whisky and watches the Utah Jazz


Andrew is an accountant and the founder of Illumin8, an accounting firm geared towards helping small businesses and thrives on putting the culture of old world accounting behind. He is also a whisky enthusiast and super fan of the Utah Jazz basketball team.

Andrew received a CA in accounting from The Institute of Chartered Accountants in Australia.

In this episode, Andrew talks about his goals of creating a better culture in the workplace through his company and how he wants to prioritize his clients’ experience with him. He also tells us how he was introduced to whisky, and becoming a fan the Utah Jazz and basketball in general.


Episode Highlights

• Discovering whisky
• ‘The Whisky Wankers’ and sharing his passion for whisky with his colleagues
• Andrew’s experience of seeing a Utah Jazz game
• Why he decided to start his own accounting firm
• How the culture of Illumin8 brings a positive effect to their clients
• Andrew’s top fears of how the company presents themselves to their clients
• Andrew’s perspective behind the ‘old world’ culture of accounting
• An important question he asks his clients


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Other pictures of Andrew

(click to enlarge)

A shot from a group back home that Andrew helps to run called “Whisky Wankers”

Andrew and his family

Andrew’s first and only live Utah jazz game, a seat behind the bench

At a Bar in Glencoe, Scotland

Andrew’s links



  • Read Full TranscriptOpen or Close

    Welcome to Episode 173 of the Green Apple Podcast. This is John Garrett. Each Wednesday, I interview a professional who just like me is known for a hobby or a passion or an interest outside of work. They’re shattering that stereotype, maybe standing out like a green apple in a boring red apple world. To put it another way, it’s encouraging people to find their “and” as in my guest today. Andrew Van De Beek is an accountant “and” a whiskey enthusiast “and” a crazy Utah Jazz basketball fan, which is super weird because he lives in Australia.

    Before we get into that, I’ve got a quick favor to ask. If you like to show and are listening to iTunes or on your favorite Android App, don’t forget to hit subscribe so you don’t miss any of the future episodes because I love sharing such cool stories each and every week. This week is no different with my guest, Andrew Van De Beek. He’s the Founder and Chief of Purpose of Illumin8, a cloud accounting firm in Australia. He was the 2018 Accounting Thought Leader of the Year. This is going to be so much fun, Andrew. I’m so excited to have you on the Green Apple Podcast.

    Andrew: Thanks for having me. I am absolutely stoked. I’m a little bit disappointed. It’s taken 172 episodes to get here. But I’m glad that we’re finally here.

    John: Right. Well, you know what? I had to practice 171 times to bring to the good stuff.

    Andrew: All right. I look forward to it. This is going to be good.

    John: Absolutely. People like Trent McLaren and all those clowns that I just practiced on, Chris Hooper and Sammie Johannes and all those, they were just practice. This is finally the real ones. But before we get into it, I’d like to get to know Andrew on another level here with my 17 rapid-fire questions. I’m going to fire away here and see how compatible we can be here. But how about do you have a favorite color?

    Andrew: Purple.

    John: Purple? Nice. How about a least favorite color?

    Andrew: Red.

    John: Red. Interesting. Okay. How about do you prefer more Sudoku or crossword puzzles?

    Andrew: Oh, gee. Neither.

    John: Neither. Okay. How about as an accountant, I have to ask, more balance sheet or income statement?

    Andrew: Oh, balance sheet.

    John: Balance Sheet. Yeah. I know you’d fly quite a bit on your airplanes. More window seat or aisle seat?

    Andrew: The window. You can pull a pillow on that sucker. You can fall asleep so good.

    John: Exactly. How about do you have a favorite number?

    Andrew: When I was growing up, my granddad used to always tell me the best multiple times like the number seven times seven. Seven times seven is 49. That has just stuck with me forever.

    John: Interesting. That’s very cool. How about do you have a favorite food?

    Andrew: Lasagna. Yeah. Lasagna with hint of cheese and a bit of chili sauce in there too.

    John: Oh, nice. That’s a good little wrinkle there, good little wrinkle. How about do you prefer more hot or cold?

    Andrew: I like cold. Yeah. In terms of drink, I like cold drinks. In terms of weather, I figured when it’s cold, you can rug up. You can put more layers on. When it’s too hot, you can start peeling your skin off, which to get colder.

    John: Right. Exactly. How about more Star Wars or Star Trek?

    Andrew: Star Wars for sure. This is not even a question.

    John: Right. I’m with you on that one. I’m with you on that. How about when it comes to computer, more of a PC or a Mac?

    Andrew: PC or Windows. I mean I’m almost an anti-apple guy you could call. I’m one of those nasty people.

    John: Right. No, no. I’m with you on that. I’m with you on that. I think it’s overrated. Now, when it comes to your mouse, your computer mouse, more right click or left click?

    Andrew: Right click. Oh, hold on. Yeah. I’m thinking with my left. Yeah, left click, left click.

    John: Left click, making the decisions. There you go. You’re clicking on stuff. Yeah. Absolutely. How about do you have a favorite animal? Any animal at all?

    Andrew: I’m a big fan of dogs, but the particular dog is the boxer dog with the kind of bouncy playfulness. We went and saw some puppies the other day like ten of them. Oh, man, I was amiss but it was all good fun.

    John: Right. Right. How about more pens or pencils?

    Andrew: Pens.

    John: Pens. There you go. No mistakes.

    John: Yeah. I think I know this one but jeans or Khakis?

    Andrew: Jeans. Yeah.

    John: For sure. Then how about your toilet paper roll, over or under?

    Andrew: Over. Yeah, over.

    John: All right. Over and Star Wars, I can’t believe these are questions, right? Two more. How about do you have a favorite Disney character?

    Andrew: Well, Disney owns everything now, right? Like play or novel like Star Wars, so all of them and above. But yeah, I wouldn’t say I really have a particular one. I can’t think of anything else at the top of my head.

    John: Okay. So all of those. All right. The last one, the favorite thing you have or the favorite thing you own?

    Andrew: It’s probably my whiskey collection.

    John: Your whiskey collection. There you go.

    Andrew: Yeah. It’s many things. It’s all good.

    John: Yeah. You’ve had that for — what’s the oldest bottle in your collection?

    Andrew: The oldest in terms of when I pushed, it’s probably around about five years.

    John: Wow. That’s awesome, very cool. There we go. Now that we got to know Andrew on another level here, I figured out it just translated into that whiskey collection. It’s just how did you get into it?

    Andrew: This is a really cool story about just people doing great things in small business. I still live on what’s called the Mornington Peninsula in Victoria. I used to live in Phlox Street, Dromana. In there, there’s not particularly much to do. But it’s beaches. It’s a beautiful place in the world. About five doors down from my shop in Australia, — I’m not sure what you guys call it in the States but we call bottle shops. Bottle shops is where you go buy beer and spirits and all that kinds of things. The guy, I went by. He bought that store. I’ve turned it over from being a run-of-the-mill kind of bottle shop which is that the standards like Jack Daniel’s, Jim Beam Beers, some wine and whatnot. He totally got it. It was floor to ceiling, like specialty spirits and all kinds of things, as well as the run-of-the-mill stuff there too.

    I’d go. I think it’s five building down from my house. That’s just near one level. He started going, “Hi. Do you want to try some whiskey?” I’m like, “I don’t really drink whiskey, mate.” That’s a bit too rough for me. Well, what he did is he said, “Turn around and shut your eyes.” I’m like, “What’s going on here?” He’d get a couple of little mini classic shot classes and perhaps pour them with four or five different types of whiskeys. He get me come around. I wasn’t allowed to know what I was trying. He just said, “Just try it. Tell me what you think.” All of a sudden, I started going, “Oh, actually I don’t mind that. I don’t mind missing.” What it was is he was creating an environment and an experience for me, but I was able to learn whether I like something or not without it being forced on me. I found as a result of that, that just led me down the slippery slope of like, “This guy’s shop is one of the best in Victoria to find specialty whiskeys.” I’d go there still on a regular basis even though I live now half an hour away from that place and see the guy, a good friend as well. It sent me on a journey. I think my wife and my mother might not like him all that much at times, but it’s been great.

    John: Right. Well, it’s not like you met him before you got married and he was invited to the wedding. Although he probably will.

    Andrew: He would have been pouring on the drinks on the wedding. Everything would’ve been great.

    John: Right. Because I mean I would think the same thing as, “Wow, whiskey.” Yeah. I mean it’s the phrase “puts hair on your chest” or whatever. It’s like, “Oh, yeah. No, I’m more of a wine guy.” It’s cool that he created that for you. It also showed you, well, there’s a next level to some of this stuff that maybe you’ve never tried before.

    Andrew: Absolutely. It wasn’t just whiskey. He was letting me try a whole bunch of different stuff. I just kind of found my wedding. I like this style of whiskey. Then I like this stuff of whiskeys. Then he helped me to kind of shrink in on that and then expand back out. We now put on nights with groups of people where we go to his store later on in afternoon evening. We just try a whole whack of different whiskeys. We let other people experience that as well. It’s great.

    John: That’s really cool. Is that something that you invite clients and coworkers too?

    Andrew: Yeah. There’s this group of us on the Peninsula. Hopefully, I’m allowed to use this word. But we refer to ourselves as the whiskey wankers. It sounds a bit obscene. But in Australian terms, a wanker is someone who’s a bit snobby, who’s a bit perfectionist, who’s a bit particular about what it is. We find that a lot of people who get into whiskey become that kind of person, really particular about that. We have this group of people. We put on a tasting event. We allow anyone to be a part of it who has an interest in whiskey. As a result, we have events where we go to his place. We do tastings. Or we put on our own cultured, structured it tasting nights. I’m actually planning one at the moment where it’s going to be called “around the world.” Every single bottle of whiskey we try will come from a different country. The whiskey is not allowed to come from Scotland, Ireland, America or Australia or Japan, which are in our eyes, the five biggest producers of whiskeys.

    John: Yeah. I was going to say you’re going to have to dig deep.

    Andrew: Oh, I’ve got some really interesting ones in the lineup. It’s going to be fun.

    John: Very cool man. That’s really neat. Do you feel like this has benefited — it translated at all into your work?

    Andrew: A hundred percent, mate. What I found is that people know that I have this passion about whiskey. I’m not the most old guy out there. I don’t know everything about it at all. But I love it. What it means is my clients start having these conversations with me about things, either the whiskey that I’m passionate about or what they’re passionate about because they see that it’s, “Oh, we don’t have to talk about business all the time. I can talk about what it is that I actually care about, what I actually want to do with my life.” All of a sudden, it opens those conversations up. As well as like getting the random text message on a Sunday morning saying, “Oh, I was at that whiskey bar last night and took a couple of photos, thought of you.” I just find that there’s a much more authentic, real relationship that goes on as a result of being open with things that I’m passionate about.

    John: I love that. I love that how you reference. It’s what they really want to talk about what we actually love. I mean we can love our work. But if you were a gazillionaire and won the lottery, would you still do accounting? I mean you’re a whiskey enthusiast for free. If anything, you’re paying money to do it, would you pay money to do accounting? Probably not. Do you know what I mean? I mean most people that have a professional services job especially, it’s something where that’s who they really are. I love how you recognize that and can see the benefits of that.

    Andrew: Totally. The other benefit is they know I love whiskey. If they want to get me a gift, they’re going to get me a gift that I’m not going to like rather than some —

    John: Right. Yeah. Because I mean if they don’t know, then they’re getting you some generic stuff. It’s like, “Whoa. What?”

    Andrew: Oh, yeah. They’ll ask me. They’ll look on me, “I want to get you a gift. What should I get you?” I’m like, “Well, tell me what your budget is first because I don’t want to get you in trouble.” Then they’ll say, “This is the budget.” I’m like, “Oh, so anything from that range and give it a crack. Then as long as we get to have some of it together, that’s all good.”

    John: Really cool man. I can’t let the Utah Jazz reference go either. How did you get into that?

    Andrew: I’ve always liked sport. Kind of grow up being sport-driven people. Basketball was the sport that I played growing up a lot now. This Australian football — and my dad was actually quite good Australian footballer. My mom didn’t want me to get injured. She didn’t want me to play footies. I ended up playing basketball. Now, knee reconstructions and all kinds of things later, I realized that may be jumping up and down in hardwood floors isn’t a good sport to do. I got into the Jazz. I’m just watching it. It would have been about ten, 12 years ago and just fell in love with Andrei Keirilenko and Mehmet Okur and Deron Williams, Carlos Boozer and those kind of guys who are up and coming around that point in time. It was also nasty time in the Jazz period where all of a sudden Jerry Sloan finished coaching. They’re all going to quit. I just became enamored with the team and some of the history of the plays that they’ve had in the past, Stockton and Malone and what that represents. I just fell in love with them for some crazy reason. Now, I’m that guy who just — I’m such a one eyed supporter. I can’t even buy a jersey of another player even though I respect them and not really appreciate them. Whereas I’ve got other mates before in the team. They’ve got like, “If it’s not Jazz, I can’t do it.”

    John: That’s fantastic. I mean the Jazz are so old school. I mean Stockton and Malone, the pick and the role. Jerry Sloan is the coach. I mean they were just super old school. I mean that franchise is just looked at that way. That’s neat.

    Andrew: Look, we’ve got a good season ahead where the team’s looking good. There’s a couple of Aussies on the team, which is always handy. I finally got to go watch a game actually. About two years ago, I was in America for the Accountex Conference in Vegas, which really was just like we could say a cover so I could go and watch as much basketball as possible.

    John: Right. Right.

    Andrew: I went to Salt Lake City. I was there for a few nights. I could just sit the seat behind the player’s bench and got to watch them.

    John: Wow.

    Andrew: We lost the Memphis of all things. But it was like, now, you have those moments in life where you enter into a room or a space. It was just like a bucket list. I’m standing there with emotion flowing through me going like, “Holy crap, I’m finally in this space. This is amazing.” All it was was the freaking basketball game in Salt Lake City. But for me, it was just incredible, something I’d never thought I’d be able to experience.

    John: Yeah. And something that you’ve seen on TV so much and now you’re in it. Especially you’re right behind the players’ bench, so you’re probably on TV. It’s like, “You’ve got to watch what you do.”

    Andrew: Yeah. I was sitting next to some dentist from New York. We’re having a good old time.

    John: That’s really cool man. That’s really neat. I mean do you come across other Utah Jazz fans in Australia?

    Andrew: There’s plenty of NBA fans, right? American sport in Australia is definitely something that’s so popular. I mean of all the thing I love about the way that Americans do sports is it’s a massive spectacle. It’s not just the game itself. But it’s the game and everything happening around the game. I think that’s one thing that Australian sports doesn’t quite have as much. The Australian sport is probably more of a pure sport than the spectacle sport that you guys have there. But yeah, like the basketball and NFL and then to lesser extent, baseball and ice hockey, very popular still here. I got a friendship networks that I have this huge fantasy sport groups here and there and getting devastated when basketball players blow their knee out. You draft it in the fourth round of your fantasy league. It’s very popular. It’s very thriving. I think it’s a big growth. When you’ve got Australians that come and play in that league, all of a sudden, your country starts paying a lot more attention to what’s going on as well. We’ve been seen as being there and getting there last year as well. It’s pretty massive.

    John: That’s cool man. That’s really cool. I guess just looking back on your accounting career, were you always open about these outside of work passions or interests? Or was it just something that came up recently?

    Andrew: No. Look, that’s probably something that’s developed over. I’d say probably the last three to six years give or take. I spent the start of my career working in heavy corporate. I was with KPMG straight at the hospital. I picked up a role. It’s like a study and work at the same time, which was a really good experience to learn the nuts and bolts of what the accounting industry delivers and how a large business and firm like that operates. However, it also removes a lot of the emotion from it. It becomes almost robotic in nature in a lot of sense. My first six years of the accounting industry, it’s very much transactional robotic nature. We have the document. We do the document. We move on. Who you are and what you’re about is not overly all that important. At least, that was my experience back then.

    I shifted to a smaller firm back where I grew up. I spent a couple years there and just continue to notice that, “This accounting thing, it’s all about these transactions.” I feel like no one cares about the client. I feel like there’s nothing going on in that environment where we’re actually connecting with our clients and understanding them more and allowing them to understand who we are too. That led me to leave and start my own business, Illumin8, with a business partner back then who’s now since moved on. That was that catalyst. Then when I bought my business partner out about two and a half, three years ago now, that was the massive shift for this whole, like what I could call our transparency and authenticity drive. What we realized is our biggest strength is not the technology we use. It’s not the education we have. It’s not a service we deliver. But it’s who we are as people and how we deliver that and the authenticity.

    All of a sudden, I was realizing, “We’re not always known this, always known this.” There were clients who you loved who will allow you to do more work with them, who will pay you a bit of money and all those kind of things. There were ones that you weren’t. Then you start looking at why. You realize that, “Those are the ones that I could be myself around. Those are the ones that I don’t have to put this accounting mask on.” That was three years ago where I had that bit of a revelation. Our business transformed substantially where everything we represent now in terms of digital image, in terms of when we work with clients, in terms of when you walk up the stairs into our office and there’s some punk rock music playing with dudes with work jeans and T-shirts or whatever it is that they feel like being in the day, it becomes that real safe space that is being who you are. Our clients love it. They love it so much. They become that raving fan of how we go about doing things. They want to be around us more as a result.

    John: That’s really cool man. I love hearing this. I love hearing this so, so much that you had the guts to put it into practice, but not only that. But it’s clearly super successful.

    Andrew: Well, what we were facing was like there was three fears that I have this point in time. The Fear Number One was like, “Okay, we’re going through this rebrand, rediscovery because the business partners moved on. We’re trying to figure out who we are. What if we say this is who we are and people don’t like it?” It was the Fear Number One or, “What if people don’t like who we are?” Fear Number Two was, “What if we say this is who we are, but it’s actually not? Like we say something and we can’t live up to that.” That was Fear Number Two there. Most of the fears really build off negativity. “What if we can’t live up to it? What if people don’t like it?” But the Fear Number Three was built out of more of a positivity. It was the bigger one. The fear was, “What if we don’t actually represent ourselves well? What if we’re not being authentic? What if people find out? What if people all of a sudden realize that we aren’t those people and we can’t afford not to take this change? We can’t afford not to be real and authentic and allow people to see ourselves?” Because they’re just going to see through the mask that we put on at one point in time. That’s going to be a much worse experience than someone going, “Oh, hi Illumin8. I’d like to work with you.” Then we have a conversation that go, “You know what? I don’t think we’re a right fit because of A, B, and C.” We’re like, “That’s perfectly fine. Have a great day.” We’ll just move on to the next person that’s going to be the right fit with us.

    John: Yeah. Because when it is the right fit, I mean you can’t be that for everybody. You find that right fit. Then magic happens. Then that client relationship is probably never ever going to go away. It’s stronger than ever. You’re able to provide much better services to them. They’re able to be much more satisfied. Everybody wins in the end. Kudos to you, man, and the team for doing that. That’s really cool man. Why do you think it is that early on in your career and most of our default mode is to not want to share or not want to open up?

    Andrew: Well, I think the accounting industry is a very old industry. It’s steeped in a lot of traditions. There’s a lot of this “you have to earn it” mentality. You have to have a certain period of experience. You have to finish your university college education. Then you have to become a CA or a CPA. This takes amount of time to be able to get to there. Throughout this time, you’re effectively told that you are not good enough right now. What good enough looks like is the people who’ve spent all their time and those particular people who are maybe in their forties or 50s or 60s or whatever that is. I guess what they grew up and the people that they are in the culture that they have actually doesn’t reflect on the people who are in their 20s and in their 30s. They grew up at a different time of life.

    What I think is that we’re trying to put an expectation of who an accountant should be on someone from totally different generations and especially also recognizing, I guess, the modern day that we live in right now and what people value more. What I find is people don’t particularly care that I’m a chartered accountant. People care that I’m a good person. People care that I can have the right conversation. People care that I actually care about their business as well. It’s just an added bonus when they go, “Oh, you’re a chartered accountant.” I don’t even know what that means. I just assume that it means something important. The only people that I find that really know what that means in my space, other people who are older who are in their 40s and 50s. To some extent, that adds a little bit more validity to them but not necessarily to other people.

    John: Yeah, absolutely. Because people just try to put you into a bucket. Actually, you’re a whiskey enthusiast, Utah Jazz playing father that happens to be good at accounting.

    Andrew: Exactly. On a real quote, I use this phrase. It’s like, “I’m not an accountant named Andrew. I’m Andrew who happens to be an accountant.” I think we put the words in front of the other ones. We will say, “Oh, there’s the accountant over there instead of, “There’s Andrew over there.” It just creates this stereotype of people of what that looks like. The accounting industry typically it’s not the most entertaining, fun space to be in. It’s often filled with people who are good at numbers and analytics and those kinds of things. Maybe they’re not the liveliest of people historically. But those people actually are quite interesting if we allow them to be themselves.

    John: Yeah. I love that. Because I mean they really are. I mean there’s 172 now, people that are very interesting. There’s so many more out there that are around you if you just give them that space. Because so many times, I think people are asking permission instead of just going and doing it. Because nothing bad happens when you go and do it within reason. I mean it doesn’t make you worse at your job. It doesn’t distract you from your job. I mean we’re not talking about drama. We’re talking about, “These are true passions.” Talking about them and sharing them and if anything, it’s gas on a fire that just makes you better at what you do.

    Andrew: For us, it’s about purpose too. It’s funny. But for me, whiskey has a purpose in my life. At our business, Illumin8, we have a golden question. We ask every one of our clients this. We say, “If you could do one thing tomorrow morning, regardless of time, money or location with no restrictions at all, when you get out of bed, what would you do?” A lot of people have never really been asked that question. We never had the authority to answer it honestly. Because I feel like they’ve got to go, “Oh, I’d probably work on a marketing plan. I’d go and hire 12 more people.” That’s like, “No, no. What would you do? It doesn’t have to be work. What would you do?” Then they go, “Oh, well, I’d probably take the dog for a walk on the beach. Or I’d love to go on a skiing holiday in Japan. Or I’d like to go and build a custom made guitar that I’ve always wanted to do.” All of a sudden, these passions start coming out. Then we say, “Well, why don’t we build a business that helps you to do that?” Because it’s not about how much money you make or the people you hire or the clients you work with. It’s about what your business allows you to do tomorrow. For me, whiskey, if I could do anything tomorrow morning, I’d open my own whiskey bar in a heartbeat. I’m about trying to build an accounting business that empowers all of my people to be amazing so I can get out of my own business and go and chase that dream.

    John: No, good for you, man. That’s really cool. I love the philosophy of it all. I hope that people listening are encouraged to do the same. Do you have any words of encouragement to people that are listening that maybe think that their passion has nothing to do with accounting. “Why? There’s no charge code for this. Why should I talk about it?”

    Andrew: Look, I think it’s a matter of saying, like in a passion-accounting. You need to look at that from yourself, a perspective of who you are. You’re a person that is an accountant. You’re a person that does this. It’s not trying to put accounting first then say, “Well, where does everyone fit into this accounting space?” I think if you can allow your personality to have a whole bunch of things and one of those things is you’re an accountant, I think it becomes a lot easier when you’re looking at it from that lens. If it’s like, “Oh, I need to be this accountant. But I have to do that. I have to do that,” that’s where it becomes really hard. Especially if you’re working in a larger environment where the business might have hundreds of employees and a lot of policies and procedures on how you do certain things. You might feel restricted in terms of being able to be yourself in that space.

    Now, you can still do that. I had this conversation a while ago when I did a presentation. People are like, “Oh, well, I’m in a large organization. Andrew, you’re the CEO. You’re the marketing guy. You’re the sales guy. You do everything in the business. You can do whatever you want.” I’m like, “That’s true. But I also have to do everything. You don’t have to do marketing and sales. All you have to do on your job is be yourself.” If you can be yourself in that space as well as be a good accountant in terms of the technical skills and applications of what you do, those are the only two things you have to worry about right now. If we can get that right early, when you get to a point where you have authority and other things, you might be running your own business, it’s going to be a lot more natural then. But if you’re looking at it in the early days that you can’t do that, you’ll get to a point where all of a sudden, it’s a massive shift for you. All I’d encourage is what are you doing in the earliest stages as a little tiny baby steps to be able to start, allowing yourself to be real from the beginning rather than having to change it.

    John: Yeah. That’s awesome man. I love it. Really great, Andrew. Well, it’s only fair, before I wrap this up, to offer to turn the tables where you can now ask me rapid-fire questions if you’d like. Let’s see if you want to fire away, get to know me on a different level here.

    Andrew: I do have a couple for you. Now, I just shared the Illumin8 golden question, so might as well throw that back to you. If you could do one thing tomorrow morning, regardless of time, money, location with no restrictions at all, when you get out of bed, what would you do?

    John: Wow. Well, talk to Andrew Van De Beek as already done today. So check.

    Andrew: Really, what’s the number one thing on your bucket list right now?

    John: Yeah. The number one thing on the bucket list would be definitely to see Notre Dame play in the college football and national championship.

    Andrew: How realistic is that? Do you think it’s going to happen?

    John: Actually, yeah. They’re number five in the country right now. There’s a good chance this year that it might happen. I’m a big fan of college football and sports in general. I get really into it. It’s my happy place for sure. But yeah. I mean, I guess, yeah. Goodness. I mean I just learned how to snowboard last year. I’d love to just go snowboarding and just continue to get better at it. I’m decent at it. But I’d like to be better.

    Andrew: All right. Cool. I’ve got another one for you. Would you rather always be ten minutes late or always 20 minutes early?

    John: Oh, man. I guess 20 minutes early because if you’re ten minutes late, then you’re making everybody else. You think you’re more important than everybody else? I guess I’d say 20 minutes early. Then I’ll just read a lot of books I guess. Because I’ll just read while I wait.

    Andrew: I feel like I’m always 20 minutes early anyway. I’m that paranoid person who doesn’t ever want to be late. I’m always at the airport way too early. Then I’m just sitting there in those crappy airport chairs waiting for a plane to come.

    John: That’s hilarious. Now, at an airport, I am right on time. I want to be the last one on the plane. I just want to walk right in and walk right onto the plane. I don’t want to sit around with these people. I got to sit on a plane with them long enough.

    Andrew: All right. I’ve got another one. Would you rather be alone for the rest of your life or always surrounded by people that you hate?

    John: I’d be alone. I mean I’m alone a lot of my life right now anyway. I just prefer quiet. Yeah. Annoying people, I mean really, that’s almost just going outside. It’s going to annoy me a lot of times, like going to the airport for instance. I don’t know why it is now that people think that because you have a cell phone and you don’t have earphones, that you could just play your video on max volume.

    Andrew: Oh, when they’re on the plane. They’re watching these shows it on a plane. I’m in Amsterdam right now. I spent 22 hours on a plane. Fourteen hours of that flight, some bloke in front of me just started — he wasn’t going to watch the movies at the airline. He’s going to watch everything on his own iPad with no headphones.

    John: No. Unacceptable. Unacceptable. I mean that is unacceptable. You should be kicked out of the plane with or without parachute. I don’t care. You’re done. Yeah, so definitely alone. Although if you left me with a lot of annoying people, slowly but surely, I would become alone. Because they would want off — like, “Hey, where’d that guy go?” “I don’t know.” You disappeared. Well, this was so much fun, Andrew. Thanks so much for taking time on your holiday to Amsterdam to be a part of the Green Apple Podcast.

    Andrew: Thanks, man. I really appreciate it. It’s been a blast.

    John: That was really, really great, so many takeaways for everyone listening. If you’d like to see some pictures of Andrew courtside at a Utah Jazz game or maybe with some pictures with some of his whiskey group or connect with him on social media, be sure to go to greenapplepodcast.com. While you’re on the page, please click that big green button. Do the anonymous research survey about corporate culture. It’ll really help for the book I’m launching in a couple of months. Thanks again for subscribing on iTunes or whatever app you use and for sharing this with your friends, so they get the message that we’re all trying to spread which is to go out and be a green apple


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