Apple PodcastsSpotifyPodchaserStitcherOvercastPocketCastsAcastiHeartRadioSoundCloud

John Garrett [00:00:00]:
Hey, this is John Garrett. I’m passionate about making work more human, especially in this age of AI. I don’t just host this podcast, I also help organizations put people first. Through my keynote speaking, coaching and What’s Your “And”?™ implementation programs. To learn more or to connect with me on LinkedIn or Instagram, I invite you to join the movement at www.whatsyourand.com. Now let’s jump into this week’s conversation.

Denise Froemming [00:00:27]:
Hi, this is Denise Froemming and when I’m not drinking matcha and connecting people, I am listening to John Garrett on What’s Your “And”?.

John Garrett [00:00:34]:
Welcome to episode 723 of What’s Your “And”?. This is John Garrett and each Wednesday I interview a professional who just like me, is known for a hobby or a passion or an interest outside of work. And to put it another way, it’s encouraging people to find their and those things above and beyond your technical skills is the things that actually differentiate you when you’re at work. It’s the answer to the question of who else are you beyond the job title. And if you like what the show’s about, be sure to check out the award-winning book. It’s on Amazon, Indigo, Barnes and Noble Bookshop, a few other websites. All the links are@whatsyourand.com it goes more in depth with the research behind why these outside-of-work passions are so crucial to your corporate culture. And I can’t say how much it means that everyone’s reading it and running such nice reviews on Amazon.

John Garrett [00:01:22]:
Thank you so much for those. And if you haven’t done one, get on it. And more importantly, changing the cultures where they work because of it. And if you want me to read it to you, that’s right, this voice reading the book, look for what’s your and on audible or wherever you get your audio books. And please don’t forget to hit subscribe to the podcast. You don’t miss any of the future episodes. Others sharing such interesting stories each and every week. And this week is no different with my guest Denise Froemming.

John Garrett [00:01:44]:
She’s the president and CEO of Cal CPA and now she’s with me here today. Denise, thanks so much for taking time to be with me on What’s Your “And”?.

Denise Froemming [00:01:54]:
Oh thank you. I’m so excited to be here with you. And do check out John’s book, it’s fabulous.

John Garrett [00:01:59]:
Well, thank you so much, Denise. It’s been so fun getting to know you over the last what, year and a half?

Denise Froemming [00:02:04]:
Probably, yeah, I’m a fan. I’m a fan.

John Garrett [00:02:06]:
Ditto. Likewise. So I appreciate it. So we’re all pulling the wagon in the right direction. More humans. Not anti AI, just also human. Yes, yes, exactly. So I have 17 rapid-fire questions, things that I’ve never asked you.

John Garrett [00:02:20]:
And I thought, well, let’s do it now. Cool.

Denise Froemming [00:02:23]:
I can’t wait.

John Garrett [00:02:24]:
Yeah. Yeah. So do you have a favorite color?

Denise Froemming [00:02:26]:
Oh, I would say blue.

John Garrett [00:02:28]:
Yeah, mine too. There you go. How about a least favorite color?

Denise Froemming [00:02:31]:
Sartreus.

John Garrett [00:02:33]:
Oh, yeah. I don’t even know how to spell it. So we’re already putting that at the top of the list. There you go. Yeah. Amen. How about. Are you more talk or text?

Denise Froemming [00:02:43]:
I’m more talk, I think. Yeah, I like to talk it out.

John Garrett [00:02:47]:
Yeah, we get to the answer faster too. I think it makes for a better podcast as well. So this would be weird otherwise. Yeah. Do you like more sweet or savory?

Denise Froemming [00:02:59]:
Oh, I think savory.

John Garrett [00:03:00]:
Oh, okay.

Denise Froemming [00:03:01]:
How about you?

John Garrett [00:03:02]:
Oh, very sweet. Ice cream all day, every day.

Denise Froemming [00:03:05]:
Cake.

John Garrett [00:03:05]:
Yeah, all that. Like, I can’t believe I still have teeth. Like, that’s the level of sweet I’m at. How about puzzles? Sudoku, crossword? Jigsaw puzzle?

Denise Froemming [00:03:13]:
I like a jigsaw puzzle. And Legos.

John Garrett [00:03:16]:
Oh, Legos.

Denise Froemming [00:03:17]:
Yes, I love Legos. Every Christmas, well, Christmas Eve we get a big Lego. So last year, what do we get? Last year, something like that. And we put it McLaren. We got one year, we put him together with wine and pizza. My son makes pizza.

John Garrett [00:03:33]:
This is amazing. It sounds like an end. I’m not gonna lie to you. That sounds pretty awesome. I love it. I love it. That sounds great. Do you have a favorite actor or an actress?

Denise Froemming [00:03:43]:
I don’t know. I can’t think. Come back to that one.

John Garrett [00:03:45]:
Okay.

Denise Froemming [00:03:45]:
All right, well, I have a rain check.

John Garrett [00:03:47]:
Rain check. You can call a friend. We’re good.

Denise Froemming [00:03:49]:
I need to call a friend who’s yours. Maybe that’ll inspire me.

John Garrett [00:03:52]:
Yeah, none of them also counts. How about a toilet paper roll? You going over or under?

Denise Froemming [00:03:57]:
I’m going over.

John Garrett [00:03:58]:
Over. There you go. You had an answer for that one, that’s for sure.

Denise Froemming [00:04:00]:
I got an answer for that in our house. It has to be over, right?

John Garrett [00:04:03]:
There it is. How about more Star wars or Star Trek?

Denise Froemming [00:04:07]:
Wow, that’s hard. I like both. I like both. I would say Star Trek.

John Garrett [00:04:12]:
Okay, fair. Do you have like a specific line? Because I know the Star Trek people. It’s not all of the Star Trek. It’s a very specific of all the generation. A specific series or specific. Whatever.

Denise Froemming [00:04:24]:
Original the original.

John Garrett [00:04:26]:
Oh, wow. Oh, okay. Shatner. Okay.

Denise Froemming [00:04:29]:
Yes.

John Garrett [00:04:29]:
Go way back. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There you go. Love it.

Denise Froemming [00:04:33]:
Maybe that’s my favorite actor.

John Garrett [00:04:35]:
Okay. Oh, Leonard Nimoy.

Denise Froemming [00:04:37]:
There we go. He’s cool. Different. Yep.

John Garrett [00:04:39]:
Yeah, yeah, he’s very cool. It reminds me of an older Keanu Reeves, you know, just kind of a. Just quirky but cool at the same time. Like there’s some depth there to Leonard Nimoy. Like there’s more to that.

Denise Froemming [00:04:52]:
I like that comparison. That’s good.

John Garrett [00:04:54]:
It just came to me, actually. I’m not gonna lie. So I could be way off. Anyone listening? Just keep your opinion to yourself. As a kid, did you have a favorite cartoon?

Denise Froemming [00:05:01]:
Oh, the Flintstones.

John Garrett [00:05:03]:
Ah, yeah.

Denise Froemming [00:05:05]:
I don’t know what about it.

John Garrett [00:05:07]:
Because it was hilarious, that’s why. It’s just silly.

Denise Froemming [00:05:10]:
How about you? I gotta ask you that one.

John Garrett [00:05:12]:
You know what? This is my show. No, I’m just kidding. I’m teasing with you. I was always a Woody Woodpecker fan. And Mighty Mouse, and of course Roadrunner, Coyote. That’s always funny to Tom and Jerry. Anything, probably. They don’t have them anymore because they’re too violent.

John Garrett [00:05:26]:
I’m sure. But they were just funny. They’re just silly. Those were kind of some that come to mind. Do you have a favorite day of the week?

Denise Froemming [00:05:34]:
I think Friday. You know, you can see what you accomplished. I get ready for Saturday and Sunday to work a little more. I mean, I like Friday nights because you can have, like, hang out. I don’t feel guilty.

John Garrett [00:05:46]:
Yeah, there you go. There you go. No, that’s fair. That’s fair. Do you have a favorite number?

Denise Froemming [00:05:51]:
I think four.

John Garrett [00:05:52]:
Four. Is there a reason or.

Denise Froemming [00:05:54]:
I don’t know.

John Garrett [00:05:55]:
It’s a solid number.

Denise Froemming [00:05:56]:
I just thought four.

John Garrett [00:05:58]:
That’s as good of a reason as any. I know you’re California and all, so this may not apply, but summer, winter, spring or fall, because, you know, I’m from Chicago. Oh, right. No, I knew that. Midwest. Yeah. Yeah. So fall.

Denise Froemming [00:06:10]:
Fall is my favorite.

John Garrett [00:06:12]:
I agree. Mine too.

Denise Froemming [00:06:13]:
The leaves, the cool football. Beautiful.

John Garrett [00:06:16]:
I agree totally on that one. How about ice cream? You go in a cup or in a cone.

Denise Froemming [00:06:21]:
Oh, always a cone.

John Garrett [00:06:22]:
Always. Okay, nice.

Denise Froemming [00:06:24]:
Always a cookie cone.

John Garrett [00:06:25]:
Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Denise Froemming [00:06:26]:
I mean, there’s something about it. The small. Not.

John Garrett [00:06:29]:
Yeah. Not getting crazy with the waffle cone. Yeah, yeah.

Denise Froemming [00:06:32]:
Much indulgence. Small.

John Garrett [00:06:33]:
There you go. I got two more. So you have the accounting background, balance sheet or income statement?

Denise Froemming [00:06:39]:
Income statement, yeah. Yeah. Get to see that. Like the profit and that to me, yeah, exactly.

John Garrett [00:06:45]:
Yeah. I mean, did you lose money or make money? Where you at here?

Denise Froemming [00:06:48]:
Exactly.

John Garrett [00:06:49]:
And then last one. The favorite thing you have or the favorite thing you own?

Denise Froemming [00:06:52]:
Favorite thing I own. It’s going to sound weird because I’m not a girly girl, but it’s my perfume mirror because my mother in law gave it to my mom. So it has special meaning of like and coming together. And it was a special gift and it has bottles that my mom’s collected. So kind of fragile. So it reminds me of like life is fragile but also beautiful when I look at it. So many good memories from.

John Garrett [00:07:16]:
That’s such a great analogy. And everything about it is awesome. I love that. That’s. Yeah, that’s really cool.

Denise Froemming [00:07:22]:
I don’t like girl things, but for some reason that resonates with me. So.

John Garrett [00:07:26]:
No, that’s important. That sounds great. There’s depth to it. I like it. Very cool. Well, let’s jump in here with matcha and I’m going to just tell you straight. What is that? Like? I mean, I’m not a coffee or any. Like, I skipped that train.

John Garrett [00:07:40]:
I. Hot chocolate all day, cacao, like all day. But like I. Yeah, all that. So matcha, like where is that in the spectrum of things?

Denise Froemming [00:07:49]:
Yeah. So I couldn’t drink coffee anymore many years ago. Stomach issues. But I thought, what am I going to have? I tried mushroom coffee, all that. And I was like, oh, doesn’t do it. But I found matcha. And anyone who knows me like Denise is always on the search for the best matcha. I buy different matcha powders.

Denise Froemming [00:08:07]:
Sue coffee knows too. She asked me the other day, what’s your favorite matcha? So I bring. I have to have my matcha and if I go to someplace and it’s sweetened, I won’t have it. So I’m not a sweet person. So I bring my own matcha and I bring my own frother with me. So sew. Richard, she’s like, what’s your favorite frother? So that’s.

John Garrett [00:08:24]:
Oh, so even the frother and the matcha. So it’s a tea, right?

Denise Froemming [00:08:28]:
No, no, it’s a powder. It’s a green tea powder. And there’s like ceremonial or there is not. And there’s a certain green to it. So yeah, there’s a whole thing. I’ll make you a cup one day.

John Garrett [00:08:41]:
Okay. No, I’ll take you up on that because that sounds fantastic. That’s amazing. And so like this is something that. Yeah, I mean, I guess when the coffee got Shut off. Then you were like, well, I gotta have something warm to put in my body in the mornings or what have you. So that’s where that came about.

Denise Froemming [00:08:56]:
Yeah. Caffeine A little.

John Garrett [00:08:57]:
There you go. Yeah, that’s awesome. So do you have some favorite matcha stories or places where you’ve been, where you’ve gotten it, where you’re like, oh, that was cool, Or.

Denise Froemming [00:09:06]:
Yeah, I try to seek out local coffee shops and a lot of them now have their own and they make it. I do have favorite stories because I’m usually there sharing my matcha with someone. Right. They’re not always a matcha person, but we go to. I was in a really nice. In West Palm Beach. It’s because one of my friends lives there and she. Interesting story.

Denise Froemming [00:09:26]:
So we went there. She had a chocolate martini, but I had a matcha. So it was a little better, but I had my mantra. But then she sent me. I said, oh, this is such a good matcha. So she sent me a bag from there after I was there. So, yeah, there’s just always good stories of sharing moments, I guess, the human piece over, you know, coffee or matcha, whatever your choices together in a space and helping support local businesses. I think that’s the key.

John Garrett [00:09:55]:
Yeah, very much. And I mean, whenever I set up, like, a meeting with somebody in person, if we happen to live, you know, nearby somebody in Colorado, or I’m going to be in their city or whatever, it’s always coffee slash hot chocolate. Because I’m getting hot chocolate. And then almost every time they sit down and then they look at my, like, giant whipped cream pile on top of this awesome mug of hot chocolate. And every time they go, I should have got hot chocolate. Yeah, you should have. Like, why didn’t you? What are you trying to pretend to be an adult? Like, no, like, hot chocolate. What the hell are you doing? That’s.

John Garrett [00:10:28]:
I put it right there in the calendar. Invite. So usually coffee slash matcha or just put matcha first. Like, I mean, why not? You know, because it’s like, that way then they know, like, this is what’s going down.

Denise Froemming [00:10:37]:
I like it. So do you have sprinkles that you put on top or something?

John Garrett [00:10:40]:
I’ll do it. I’ll do it for sure. I am kind of hypocritical, though, because I’ll use the oat milk, but then they’re like, whipped cream. I’m like, yeah, like, you can’t say no to whipped cream. Come on now.

Denise Froemming [00:10:51]:
Like, I’d do the same if I

John Garrett [00:10:53]:
were you and it’s never plant based whipped cream. It’s always, you know, regular whipped cream. But whatever, who cares? Just put it in there, we’ll be fine. So I love that, but I love too how you brought up like that, having it with someone else and creating that human connection. And I think that’s a big piece of you as well that. I mean, in the year and a half that I’ve known you, you know, I think that’s something that drives you as well. And is that something that’s been part of who you are for ever since the beginning?

Denise Froemming [00:11:19]:
Yeah, I like connecting people and I don’t know, people projects, like whatever it may be. I said I’m a bridge builder. I kind of feel that way. When I was 8, I don’t know how many of you know, but John knows. Muscular dystrophy campaign that was Jerry Lewis was big.

John Garrett [00:11:34]:
Yeah.

Denise Froemming [00:11:34]:
So I thought maybe I can. They would give out packets. So you’d write in. I think you wrote in. You get a packet.

John Garrett [00:11:40]:
I’m sure you wrote in back in those days.

Denise Froemming [00:11:42]:
Yeah, yeah, I think I wrote in or something and I got a packet. And I had a carnival. So you’d raise money, right? And you’d raise it locally. And so I thought, oh, what can I do? So I had a carnival in our garage and I had friends come, family, friends of friends. And we raised, I don’t know, $80. That was a lot back then. I won’t tell you what year, but it was a lot back then. Yeah, yeah, it was cool.

Denise Froemming [00:12:04]:
And I thought, gosh, I can do something, connect people and do something bigger than I could do on my own. So that was my beginning. And in high school I did like, I set up a helping hands. I did a little logo. That was a little group we set up. So I just love doing that. And when my son and his friends were in high school, they asked me one day, they’re like, we know you work for a non profit. Can you help us set up one? And I’m thinking, oh my God, I don’t have like time for this.

Denise Froemming [00:12:31]:
Okay, I will help you. And they set up a crossover for cancer. So it was summer basketball tournaments they did to raise money for kids with cancer.

John Garrett [00:12:42]:
The crossover. There you go. Okay.

Denise Froemming [00:12:44]:
Yeah. So it’s like in my blood maybe that I just love to do that.

John Garrett [00:12:48]:
Yeah. And then, you know, if you’re able to bring matcha in, then extra good,

Denise Froemming [00:12:52]:
you get a matcha too.

John Garrett [00:12:54]:
Right, right. That’s incredible. I love that so much. And do you Feel like, I mean, obviously the bridge builder comes over, but the Matcha even as well. Like, do you feel like any of this translates over to. To work, whether it’s a skill set or relatability or something, a mindset?

Denise Froemming [00:13:10]:
I do. I mean, I think the. Well, the one thing I want to do is use my Matcha to have coffee chats throughout the state. When we release our new app that’s going to reach and they’ll be all local businesses. So that’s one piece. And then I mean, definitely bridge builder because you can connect people. I get so excited even if I’m connecting someone to help them with, you know, whatever it is. It’s just great if you can solve a problem right.

Denise Froemming [00:13:34]:
And connect someone or connect someone with a program or whatever they need. So yeah, it kind of goes together and I’m going to merge it all in the app with the, you know, kind of Matcha put together series.

John Garrett [00:13:45]:
I mean, why not? I mean, people like me that have never had it, it’s like, well, who better to introduce them than you? I mean, like, come on now, we could try one.

Denise Froemming [00:13:52]:
Yeah, I like that.

John Garrett [00:13:53]:
I’m all for it. Like, I think that’s great. Plus then the people that are also crazy about Matcha now you guys have best friends for no reason. I mean, you know, like now it’s like a next level connection that you guys have. So I love that. That’s fantastic. And yeah, I mean it’s. You’re making the world a better place through connecting people, you know, and it’s just, hey, you need a little help? Hey, actually I know somebody that can help.

John Garrett [00:14:15]:
Boom, done. I don’t have to do any of the lifting. I’m just the bridge. You guys take it from here.

Denise Froemming [00:14:20]:
Yeah, I’m much better at that than matchmaking. That does not work at all.

John Garrett [00:14:26]:
Different kind of bridge, that’s a rope bridge that’s with a bunch of boards missing. Like, do not go across that bridge. Like that’s exactly. I love that. So do you feel like this is something that you’ve shared through? Well, I mean through the apps getting ready to happen. But like, do you feel like this is a part of you that you’ve shared throughout your career? You know, this is Denise, take it or leave it. You know, all the parts of me,

Denise Froemming [00:14:51]:
you know, at one time, I would say because part of all of that to me centers on like servant leadership because you’re serving people and it kind of goes together.

John Garrett [00:15:01]:
Yeah.

Denise Froemming [00:15:02]:
And I remember when I did a year long program on servant leadership I remember that being not like you tell people, and they’d be like, you’re going to serve people and you’re like a leader. That seems just so dull. Right. Or it doesn’t seem like a leading leader. A leader wouldn’t.

John Garrett [00:15:19]:
It’s not a real leader.

Denise Froemming [00:15:20]:
Yeah. So that was a. Now it’s. People have accepted it more, I think. But back then, John, it was definitely, oh, you’re leading with that. That just. You’re not a real leader. It was fun.

John Garrett [00:15:33]:
I could very much see that happening. And good for you for just realizing that that’s who you were and you can’t not be that. So of course it’s going to work because I’m being me. You know, if I pretend to be whatever the heck kind of leader this person’s trying to say a leader is, well, then I’m going to fail for sure, because that’s not me.

Denise Froemming [00:15:52]:
Or people say, oh, you’re too nice. Well, it isn’t being nice. Right. It’s being open and understanding. You still have make hard. Make hard decisions, but people see nice, and so that’s kind of bundles it all together.

John Garrett [00:16:06]:
Yeah. Like, you’re gonna get taken advantage of. You’re gonna. Whatever. And it’s like, no, no, no, no. Like, you can still be caring, but have boundaries. And you can still, you know, love someone, but call them out for not doing what you know they’re capable of doing. You know, all those things.

John Garrett [00:16:21]:
And I love it, too. That’s, you know, it’s authentic. Because I feel like so many professionals are pretending to be what they think they’re supposed to be instead of just be you. And we allow professions, accounting, engineering, architecture, banking, you name it, to influence how I act. And it’s like, don’t let the profession influence the other way around. It’s the other way around. Like, we need all of you as an individual to influence the profession, not the other way around.

Denise Froemming [00:16:49]:
That creates that rich tapestry, you know, of all different people that we have.

John Garrett [00:16:54]:
And then you’ll be successful because if you’re, you know, going to work with one arm tied behind your back because you’re trying to be a leader that people think you’re supposed to be, that doesn’t drink Matcha. What are you crazy? You know, type of person, and, well, then you’re going to be miserable. And then of course you’re going to fail. And it’s like, no, no, I’m leading with this. Like, here we go, everybody. And then here we are. So that’s super cool that you Recognize that early on. I don’t doubt that for a second.

John Garrett [00:17:17]:
Knowing you, you know, it’s like, well, of course. Yeah, yeah.

Denise Froemming [00:17:20]:
Sometimes it’s, you know, hard because people want power. Power. You gotta, you know, be mean, have power. And it’s. That doesn’t always work.

John Garrett [00:17:28]:
Yeah. Or all the other ones are like this. So I have to act like that. Or, you know, this is how a CPA acts, or this is how a partner acts, or this is how an engineer. It’s like, no, none of that. Like, how do you act? And then go be the thing. But people get it upside down and identifying as their job title or their role, and that’s not who you are. That’s just what you do.

John Garrett [00:17:52]:
You know, you’re not a black shirt. I’m not a tan shirt. Like, you know, this is silly. You know, like, it’s. You’re you. And then you play this part for a little bit and then you go home and take it off and like, you know, like, there’s an underlying thing that’s. Denise, that’s powerful and bring it. That’s cool.

Denise Froemming [00:18:11]:
We get too stuck sometimes.

John Garrett [00:18:13]:
Yeah. Very much. And so how much do you feel like it’s on an organization to leadership, set the tone and create that space and care about their people to have an and or how much is it on the individual to just start small on their peers?

Denise Froemming [00:18:26]:
I think there’s a lot of onus on the organization and the leaders, in my opinion, because it’s truly an honor and a gift to lead. So I do believe you have an obligation, Right. To bring to anyone you’re leading the world and the ecosystem you’d want to be in. Right. So I think there is an obligation there. I also think there’s an obligation in each person, Right. To show up with that authenticity and also to lean in and do their part. Right.

Denise Froemming [00:18:57]:
Because you can’t just expect it to be all coming at you. It has to be both. But we have an obligation leading to make that happen. I think you’re leading other people’s kids and sisters and mothers, and so you kind of have to look at it that way instead of. And look at it longer term than looking at it as. It’s just this job. It’s like, what can you do to bring this person to their full self so that then they can go out in the world and bring more people to their full self. Like a multiplier.

John Garrett [00:19:27]:
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, you know, it’s creating that space, but then people have to pull their weight, too. But leaders can very much squash it, like, in a heartbeat, you know? And so it’s like, just don’t ruin it. Pretty much. Like, I think I was on a guest on a podcast once and people were like, what would you tell leader? I was like, just don’t ruin it. Just get out of the way. Like, you know, sort of a thing. Because if you don’t want to be in, then that’s fine.

John Garrett [00:19:49]:
But, like, don’t squash it.

Denise Froemming [00:19:50]:
That’s powerful. Like, sometimes you just got to get out of the way.

John Garrett [00:19:53]:
Yeah. And I mean, you know, you hired professional adults that are good at what they do. You know, it’s not all on you. And if you care about them and they know that you care, and then they’re going to care back. And Magic.

Denise Froemming [00:20:05]:
Yeah. Do you think people don’t get out of the way because of ego?

John Garrett [00:20:08]:
A hundred percent. 100%. I mean, what’s your and is all about coming out from behind the ego, the human behind the job title the ego wants to lead with. Look how smart I am and all my degrees and certifications and the work I’ve done and how important I am. Who else are you? Come on now. And then all of a sudden, that’s incredible. And that’s the part that I’m going to remember. All this other stuff is replaceable.

John Garrett [00:20:34]:
I know other people that have the same degrees and same certifications and probably better at their job even than, you know, so and so or whoever. Like, you know, it’s like they’re just as good as you. Like, I can find somebody in about five minutes with the Internet that’s just as good or better, but not the human and the technical skills. That combination is one in a gazillion, and it’s you. So why would you not want to bring both parts or all the parts of you really, to what you’re doing? You know, Aristotle wrote a lot about a. He called it eudaimonia of just all of who you are to all of what you do. And it’s just your best self showing up in the right time.

Denise Froemming [00:21:10]:
We lose that sometimes.

John Garrett [00:21:11]:
Well, yeah, I mean, you know, it’s. We got to pay bills and we got to make money and we got to hit these metrics and we got the billable hours that we got to hit or we got whatever. And it’s like. But at the end of the day, it’s all make believe. Come on now, you know, and if you do this other stuff, you’re going to hit all those metrics and you’re going to get all those goals and you’re going to get all the things. It’s just not how we’re trained and not our default.

Denise Froemming [00:21:35]:
Right. You may get more than you think, too.

John Garrett [00:21:37]:
Exactly. Nailed it. Yeah, that’s exactly it. So do you have any words of encouragement to anybody listening that maybe has an and that they think no one cares about or doesn’t matter?

Denise Froemming [00:21:48]:
They think, be curious and talk to people because you will find there’s more commonalities than you ever thought. There are so many times I think, oh, my gosh, there’s a common thread here almost everywhere I go. So be curious. If you’re curious and you ask people questions, you will find common threads everywhere you are and they’ll want be curious about you too.

John Garrett [00:22:10]:
Yeah, that’s awesome. You know, my favorite is so many people, when I speak at conferences will do a word cloud of everyone’s ants and Dungeons and Dragons pops up so much. Like, you would not believe in everybody when you talk to them. They’re like, yeah, so I do Dungeons Dragons. I’m like, do you know how many people do Dungeons and Dragons? It’s crazy. Like, you’re whispering it as if, like, you’re the only one. I’m telling you, there’s a dozen in this room that also, you know, that are whispering about it. But if you don’t share it, then you don’t even know.

John Garrett [00:22:40]:
Like, if you don’t say how much you love Matcha, then no one would know and you would pass by someone else who also loves Matcha and not even know it. And it’s like all of a sudden, now you’re talking blends and brands and frothers. Like, good Lord, this is next level. This is crazy. But I love that. Just be curious. So that’s awesome.

Denise Froemming [00:22:59]:
Can I be curious about you and ask you a couple questions?

John Garrett [00:23:02]:
Absolutely. I was going to say, since I rudely peppered you at the beginning, let’s turn the tables. Denise Froemming podcast. All right, here we go.

Denise Froemming [00:23:09]:
Here we go. So what’s your favorite band?

John Garrett [00:23:13]:
It’s really tough because it’s going to be a combination of Blink 182, the Killers, Ben Rector, maybe a sprinkle in some Metallica from back in the day. You know, that sort of genre, I guess, which isn’t even one genre, but whatever. Yeah, but always upbeat. Like, you know, so, you know, positive or. I don’t know if positive is the right word, but upbeat fast. Like it’s moving. It’s not.

Denise Froemming [00:23:39]:
Get your heart pounding pretty much.

John Garrett [00:23:41]:
Or it’s just like, all right, like a little bit of a hype sort of a thing.

Denise Froemming [00:23:44]:
I like that. If you were this kind of depressing, but if you were having your last meal, what would be the one food you would eat?

John Garrett [00:23:50]:
Oh, ice cream, for sure. We would lead with ice cream. That would be the appetizer. Just chunks like, you know, chocolate brownie fudge chunk.

Denise Froemming [00:23:59]:
Like peanut butter monkey.

John Garrett [00:24:01]:
Yeah. Chocolate ice cream with the peanut butter cups. Chocolate chip cookie dough. Like. Yes. All of this. Yeah. With the hot fudge.

John Garrett [00:24:09]:
Real hot fudge. Don’t try and pull off your chocolate syrup and call it hot fudge. No, no, no, no, no. Get out of here. Like, real hot fudge. Like, yeah.

Denise Froemming [00:24:17]:
You should know Emil Red, VP of technology. Ice cream is his. I give him gift cards with for ice cream for his birthday.

John Garrett [00:24:27]:
That is a perfect example of leadership that cares. It’s not a generic Amazon or whatever gift card. It’s, you love ice cream. Here’s a gift card for ice cream. And then now that person feels seen as, wow. She sees me as a human being, not just me as worker title. And that’s beautiful. Such an easy example for people to take away.

Denise Froemming [00:24:48]:
I know he likes ice cream, so you should connect if you’re together.

John Garrett [00:24:50]:
I love it. That’s awesome. I love it.

Denise Froemming [00:24:52]:
Can I do one more question?

John Garrett [00:24:53]:
It’s your show, of course.

Denise Froemming [00:24:57]:
What is the one myth about workplace culture you wish would go away?

John Garrett [00:25:01]:
I think it would be anything along the lines of, well, that’s just how it’s always been done.

Denise Froemming [00:25:11]:
The Sally.

John Garrett [00:25:12]:
Yeah, that’s same as last year. Or that’s just how the profession is. Or that’s how things are. None of those are true. And also, you’re now the managing partner, so make it what you want. Or maybe ask the next wave of leadership. What do you guys want it to be when you’re going to take over and then start doing that now? So then when they take over, they’re full speed. So anything that’s along the lines of, well, that’s just how it is, or that’s lazy, and that means you’ve done no work, you didn’t try.

John Garrett [00:25:43]:
You just let it become a Frankenstein on its own and be intentional and you don’t have to overwork it, but just be intentional with what you’re creating and really create what you would want. Just paying someone every two weeks doesn’t work anymore or ever, really, if we’re being honest. But nowadays people have options, so they’re out. And if you really think about that, they’re Working two weeks in the hole and then you fill them in. How about you’re not paying them in upfront and then they’re working it off? No, no, they’re going in the hole and then you fill them in. And so eventually over time, the filling in gets less and less and less and less. And then people are like, you know what? This is not worth it anymore. I’m going somewhere else where I think the grass is greener or whatever.

John Garrett [00:26:34]:
But really just, you know, create those experiences around what it’s like to work here. You know, a lot of the work that I do going into organizations is let’s employee journey map. Let’s look at it through the employees eyes of what’s it like all the way from the they’ve never heard of us all the way through the journey to leaving. What are those experiences? What are those emotions and thoughts that they’re going to have and how do we get ahead of that to make them feel part of the team right away? And even when they leave, they’re not going to space like they’re still here, like they can come back. So I’ve never understood that, especially in professional services where somebody leaves, they go to a, it could be a potential client and yet you treat them terribly on the way out. And then let’s say an accountant leaving a public accounting firm, well, they’re going to become a CFO over there. That’s a client that could be happening. But because you treat them like crap, well now guess who’s never going to get the work? Your firm.

John Garrett [00:27:29]:
So good work on that. Or they could come back, you know, like it’s all what’s for the greater good of that person to live their best life. Like what can I do to help you be better? And if it’s here, great. If it’s somewhere else, great. Because I’ve never understood like I’ve been to so many organizations where you walk in, it’s like, man, these are some miserable people. Like why are you here? And leadership just wants. I would rather have a room full of miserable people. No, I’d rather have three people that are loving life because they’re going to get way more done and be more fun to be around.

Denise Froemming [00:28:04]:
It’s shortsighted. I keep thinking John, like is there a way to make this world so when you, if you want to leave, you just say you want to leave and we all help everybody get to that next step and then they can come. Like there’s got to be a better way to look at the whole person There just has to be.

John Garrett [00:28:20]:
Yeah, I mean, I love with clients of mine, it’s, you know, at least annually. Two questions. What do you love to do here and how can I help you do more of it? And number two is, what do you love to do outside of work and how can I help you do more of that? Because if somebody’s not drinking their matcha or somebody’s not traveling or going in ordinary football games, in my case or whatever, then that’s not a fully activated human being and they’re of no use to you. They can be much better and more impactful if you make sure that they’re taking time to do their hands, you know, so, you know, more of that or what’s your dream job? Because buckle up. It’s probably not partner at this firm. So, you know, like, I want to be a CFO at somewhere or controller or I want to eventually this or whatever. Okay, great, let me help you get the skills to then get the job. But instead it’s, well, I’m never going to ask you.

John Garrett [00:29:15]:
And then out of nowhere, somebody’s like, well, I quit. And it’s like, well, I didn’t even know what. Why? Well, because I’ve never wanted that job. I want to go do this. And, you know, and so it’s like, show people that you care about them as a whole person, and then I promise they’re going to accidentally stay longer and some of them accidentally become partners. So, like, you know, like, but just care about them. And how can I help you? Be the best you and let’s go.

Denise Froemming [00:29:40]:
You know, I love that we’re going to add that question to our monthly milestones. Thank you.

John Garrett [00:29:44]:
Oh, you’re welcome. No, thank you for being a part of the show and for having me on your show. Actually, your real podcast that you had me on as well, well, with Cal cpa. So that was awesome. So thank you for just being a living example of what you’re in. So thanks so much, Denise.

Denise Froemming [00:29:58]:
Well, we appreciate you. And buy the book. And book.

John Garrett [00:30:02]:
John, thank you so much. Look at you. You’re bridge building right now. I know. This is. I love you so much. Thank you very much. And everybody listening.

John Garrett [00:30:13]:
If you want to see some pictures of Denise or connect with her on social media, be sure to go to www.WhatsYourAnd.com. Everything’s there. And while you’re on the page, like Denise said, don’t forget to pick up the book and you can click a big button to the anonymous research survey about corporate culture. So thanks again for subscribing on Apple podcasts or whatever app you use and for sharing this with your friends so they get the message that we’re all trying to spread that who you are is so much more than what you do.

Apple PodcastsSpotifyPodchaserStitcherOvercastPocketCastsAcastiHeartRadioSoundCloud

Welcome to episode 589 Kind of what’s your and. This is John Garrett. And each Wednesday, I interview a professional who, just like me, is known for a hobby or a passion or an interest outside of work. And to put it another way, it’s encouraging people to find their and, those things above and beyond your technical skills, the things that actually differentiate you when you’re at work. It’s the answer to the question of who else are you beyond the job title. And did you know that pictures of dogs foster social connections amongst people and promote trusting relationships in business settings, I had Michael Puck on. His end was dog photography, and he’s teamed up with others to create global dog art .com. So, check out the website.

John Garrett [00:00:56]:

All the proceeds go to save 1,000,000 dogs by 2030. So check out global dog art.com. And don’t forget to check out the website, what’s your and.com. Links to the award winning book are there and also to all the guest episodes. And please don’t forget to subscribe to the podcast so you don’t miss any of the future stories. I love sharing them each and every week, and this week is no different with my guest, Meredith Monday Schwartz. She’s the CEO of Here Comes the Guide and the host of the Currently Reading podcast, and now she’s with me here today. Meredith, thanks so much for taking time to be with me on What’s Your End?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:01:30]:

Oh, John, I am ridiculously excited to talk about these topics with you.

John Garrett [00:01:34]:

That’s awesome. Me too. So, like, let’s do we’ll jump in. But first, we have, rapid fire questions, get to know Meredith out of the gate here. And maybe an easy one. I don’t know. We’ll see a favorite Disney character.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:01:46]:

Oh, definitely Belle from Beauty and the Beast. Oh, okay. She is like me, a reader at heart, and I I love Belle.

John Garrett [00:01:54]:

Yeah. No. Solid answer. Solid answer. How about when it comes to puzzles? Sudoku, crossword, jigsaw puzzle, I guess Wordle? I’ll take that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:02]:

I love jigsaw puzzles because I can listen to an audiobook while I do. Oh, okay. There you go. There you go. I like it. Okay. How about a favorite color? Oh, peacock

John Garrett [00:02:11]:

blue. Oh, solid answer.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:14]:

Yeah. That’s my signature color.

John Garrett [00:02:16]:

Yes. Yeah. I like that. That’s a good color. How about a least favorite color?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:21]:

Oh, like a baby vomit green. There you go. Alright.

John Garrett [00:02:28]:

That’s it’s hard to argue that. Like, when vomit’s in the name,

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:30]:

it’s like, it’s not gonna

John Garrett [00:02:32]:

be good. Itself. Right. It’s not gonna be good. Not gonna be good. Oh, here’s a fun one. How about your first concert?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:39]:

Fine young cannibals. Oh my goodness. Yes. I’d so dated myself. Right

John Garrett [00:02:45]:

No. That’s awesome. Very good. You were 5. Your parents brought you. Who knows? Like, you

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:50]:

told me. In a stroller.

John Garrett [00:02:52]:

Right? That’s incredible. Wow. Okay. How about a favorite actor or an actress?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:58]:

You know, I love Octavia Spencer. I’ve been watching her latest, truth be told on Apple TV, and it is a fantastic, like, true crime drama. It’s about a podcaster. Oh, yeah. It’s really, really good, and I just love Octavia

John Garrett [00:03:13]:

Spencer. Very good. Very good. I love it. How about, this one’s an important one, toilet paper roll over or under?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:20]:

Okay, I’m gonna shock everybody out there, and I’m gonna say under. My baby’s always wanted to, like, grab it and pull, and when it’s coming from over, it’s so easy to make a mess.

John Garrett [00:03:30]:

It never stops.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:31]:

Yeah. Exactly. So under for me.

John Garrett [00:03:34]:

Okay. Okay. Well, at least there’s some logic there.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:36]:

Yes.

John Garrett [00:03:37]:

How about, Star Wars or Star Trek?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:40]:

Star Trek Next Generation all the way.

John Garrett [00:03:43]:

Oh, okay. Very specific even. Yeah. Alright. There you go. I do find that, like yeah. People that say Star Wars, it’s just Star Wars in general, but Star Trek, they wanna narrow down, like, which specific Series or movie or whatever.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:57]:

Yeah. Witch captain, and I’m Jean Luc. Yes.

John Garrett [00:04:00]:

There you go. How about your computer? More of a PC or a Mac?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:04]:

Only Max, Max all the

John Garrett [00:04:05]:

time. Okay. Alright. How about pens or pencils? Pens. Yeah? Yeah. You don’t make a mistake, so I like it. That’s good.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:14]:

I like a a really specific pen. I only use 1 particular pen, and so yeah. That’s why I stumbled because I was like, well, but there’s only 1 pen, so it’s okay.

John Garrett [00:04:26]:

So pen or pencils? I actually been the question. Right. There you go. Alright. Alright. I love ice cream. Do you have any favorite ice cream flavor?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:33]:

Ben and Jerry’s New York Super Fudge Chunk.

John Garrett [00:04:36]:

Yes. I I’m a huge fan of the chunks Yes. And ice cream. It’s it just it’s more efficient in getting more calories into my face.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:43]:

The more the more texture, the

John Garrett [00:04:46]:

better. Yes. Absolutely. I’m a 100% with this. How about a favorite day of the week?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:51]:

Well, I have to go with Monday. I am a Monday. Monday is my maiden

John Garrett [00:04:54]:

name. That is. Oh, there you go.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:56]:

Alright. Alright. That that works.

John Garrett [00:04:58]:

How about oceans or mountains? Mountains. Mountains. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I’m just kinda spoiled in Colorado, so they’re just right outside.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:07]:

Right and I grew up in California. So Oh. Which year we have beautiful oceans and mountains, but late the Lake Tahoe area is my favorite area. Yeah.

John Garrett [00:05:17]:

So beautiful. Yeah. That’s amazing. Yeah. Tahoe is nice. Really nice. How about a favorite number? 7. 7.

John Garrett [00:05:23]:

A reason?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:25]:

Just always been a good luck number for

John Garrett [00:05:27]:

me. Yeah. It’s a good number. Absolutely. 2 more or 3 more rather. Books, audio version, ebook, or real book?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:34]:

Yeah. This is a very difficult rapid fire

John Garrett [00:05:37]:

question for me because No. No. For sure.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:38]:

Could go

John Garrett [00:05:39]:

do that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:40]:

All of them. But on my actual spreadsheet, I will tell you right now, I’m at 65% of my reading this year is on Kindle Oasis.

John Garrett [00:05:49]:

Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. Alright. That’s more than I

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:52]:

anticipated. Yes. And it’s grown a lot since I got the oasis in

John Garrett [00:05:56]:

particular. Oh, okay. Alright. Alright. How about, favorite toppings on a pizza? You can load it up.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:03]:

Pepperoni and

John Garrett [00:06:04]:

pineapple. Oh, and but I never done the, 2 piece together. I like that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:08]:

That is the best.

John Garrett [00:06:10]:

Interesting because it’s always ham and

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:11]:

pineapple. No. You gotta go with pepperoni and pineapple.

John Garrett [00:06:14]:

Yeah. Okay. Alright. And the last The favorite thing you own or the favorite thing you

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:19]:

have? You know, my most prized possession is my wedding ring, which is funny because it’s just my husband and I wear matching pants. They were $40 each. They’re worth nothing financially. Sure. But that is the thing that I would be the most, like, outsizably upset if I were to lose it unexpectedly.

John Garrett [00:06:37]:

Yeah. No. I just totally understand. But the great thing is you can just grab his, and then he thinks he lost

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:41]:

his. No.

John Garrett [00:06:41]:

And then you’re like

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:44]:

right, you just share 1 back and forth. Right? Right. Right. No.

John Garrett [00:06:47]:

No. That’s awesome answer though because it’s so sentimental and and means so much. So That’s that’s awesome. Well, let’s jump into podcasting and, I mean, just, you know, of course, being the host of the Currently Reading podcast. So I’m sure it’s, you know, obviously about books that you’re reading because it’s right there on the name. So but but how did you get into the podcasting side of it?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:07:09]:

Reading’s been my main hobby since I could read. I was one of those kids who was always under the covers with a flashlight reading or under the dining room table, you know, trying to read and get everyone not to bother me, that’s always been kind of my identity. And then as, you know, social media came about, all of a sudden, there was a way for those of us who love to read more than anything, to find each other, which is absolutely fantastic. So I got involved in a book group and got to be really good friends with the woman who’s now my podcast partner, Katie Cobb, and we just had never met in real life. I had never even heard her voice. But we got to talking one day and I was like, I have this idea for a podcast. It’s 2 people talking about literally the 3 books they read most currently whether they like them or not. And this was the thing that I really wanted to do because nobody else was doing it in the book space.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:08:01]:

Nobody was actually talking about a book if it didn’t work for them. And so I wanted to talk about books. I wanted to see who wanted to listen to us talk about books. So in 2018, we got started and we just ended our 5th

John Garrett [00:08:14]:

season. Oh, congratulations. That’s incredible.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:08:17]:

I know. And we we have so much fun. We have a really formatted show. We keep it really tight. We don’t go down, like, discussive rabbit holes. We keep it really tight. It’s really about the books. And yeah.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:08:28]:

We just have had so much fun. It’s something I always look forward to. It’s a lot of work, but it has brought so much joy to my life as well as bringing a lot to my day job at Here Comes the Guide too.

John Garrett [00:08:41]:

Oh, that’s incredible. That’s awesome. Yeah. Because, I mean, That’s not the reason you did it, obviously, was what else will make me better at my career. It was more of, like, I am crazy about books And I found someone else also equally crazy about books and reads more than 3 because you obviously have to have the last 3 that you read. You can’t talk about Same 3 every offer for a year.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:09:01]:

Exactly. So we had to right. We read a lot. And so one of the things that we said at the very beginning was because we didn’t set the podcast up to be any sort of business. We weren’t gonna have a Patreon. We weren’t gonna do anything. We said, if we can just get 10 people who regularly want to listen, then that’ll be enough because all we wanna do is talk about books. And I actually think that’s the single best decision that we made was to not make it about any sort of result or metric.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:09:32]:

Trick, and in my day job, everything is about profit and all the different KPIs. Right? We love a metric. Yep. Currently Reading was a pure passion play, and that enabled us to make a lot of decisions where we didn’t have to think about some of the things you think about when money is at issue, and I think that made us

John Garrett [00:09:52]:

better. Yeah. It’s just it’s liberating because you’re you’re not playing it so safe. The the guardrails aren’t up because it doesn’t matter. Right. I mean, you know, you’re not Oprah where A 1000000000 people are listening, and, you know, at the beginning. So it’s like, well, let’s just swing for the fences every time. Why not? You know? And then and then it just You’re freer and that comes out.

John Garrett [00:10:12]:

Like, people can hear it, and and I love that. You know? It created that space for you to be able to be That. You know, take the guardrails off and and just be you instead of, you know, in the executive space where, well, you know, a little bit of guardrail helps Bad times.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:10:28]:

Right. And I tend toward not I tend toward. I’m I’m a perfectionist. I’m very I am such a perfectionist. And currently reading gave me the ability just like you said to be like, you know what? Let’s just try it and see what happens, or let me just, on the mic, be exactly who I am. And if people don’t all love who I am on the mic, that’s okay. Yeah. And that has been really helpful to me in kind of pushing out some of those walls around my comfort zone.

John Garrett [00:11:02]:

Yeah. And and that’s such a great point too of of how, you know, the the fear of being who we are at work. You know, we we Leave so many pieces of us outside the office because, well, we this has nothing to do with my job or people aren’t gonna care or what it’s like, no. No. You’re you. The leadership hired you as a human, and there’s other dimensions to you besides the technical skills part, And it’s important for that. And and so as a as a leader of an organization, how much does it matter to you that people have ands, that they you even learn what they are or that they explore them.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:11:39]:

Right. And this is something I think surprises people when they start to work for us. This is something that we definitely want to amplify in all of our employees. This is something like, if we wanna know what people do what they love doing, what lights them up. And if they have something that they wanna take from a hobby to a side hustle, we actually have I actually work with my employees, if that’s something that they wanna do, we encourage hobbies just for the sake of hobbies. But if they want to or what they love outside of work and kind of grow something into a side hustle, I actually work with them 1 on 1. We have a 4 day work week at Here Comes the Guide, so we only work Monday through Thursday? Yeah. And so on Fridays, I oftentimes will be meeting with 1 or the other member of my staff to really talk through how to grow A Side Hustle from Start to Profit.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:12:30]:

Right? And so they’re always surprised that it’s something not only that we’re okay with, but it’s something that we really love because time and time again, you know better than anyone, the people who have hobbies that they really love or things that they’re doing that Sharpen Their Saw, it makes them fresher, more creative, and better at their work for Here Comes the Guide. So I’m all about it with my employees.

John Garrett [00:12:55]:

Yeah. I love that. That’s so awesome. And so do you just ask them, or is it part of the onboarding process or the interviewing process or because, I mean, it is that simple if you just ask, but I know a lot of people listening and they’re like, well, how do you find out?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:13:10]:

Right. Well, there’s 42 of us. It’s 42 women and we have a super flat management structure, so my COO and I actually know every one of our employees really, really well. We spend a lot of time getting to know them and as individuals within our group and within their skill sets within our group, but also, you know, we shoot the s h a lot. Like, we we we really, like I mean, this is something that we take really seriously is the whole ethos around Here Comes the Guide is about being the best version of yourself inside and outside of work. So there’s no, like, work version of Meredith and home version of Meredith. It’s all 1 person and so we think about that. I think about that with everyone who works for me.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:13:55]:

So we get to know each other really well. I have you know, when people find out that I have a book podcast, I will often have people come into my virtual office. We’re fully remote, so we’re we’re all virtual, but they’ll knock on my virtual door and be like, I don’t know what book I should read next, and we’ll spend 30 minutes talking about books. And so I have multiple staffers who have incredible hobbies or side hustles outside of work and we love to talk about it. The other thing is when we have retreats, oftentimes, I like to mix up what we’re working on. I don’t wanna work on here comes the guide work at a retreat because that’s what we do all the time. So sometimes we’ll take some of the side hustle stuff, use it as a creative exercise, and kind of brainstorm together all 42 of us to talk about 1 person’s side hustle and how they can amplify it, and that’s something that we love to do together too.

John Garrett [00:14:46]:

Yeah. And that oh, man. These are such great examples of caring about the person that works for Here Comes the Guide. You know, you hired a person, not an analyst or a marketer or whatever their role is. You hired a human. And, you know, what’s the difference between sending them to technical skills training and the difference to, you know, having a retreat where we pour All of our knowledge into your hobby or, you know, side hustle. We’re making you a better person, and you’re you’re living your best life. You’re gonna do your best work, And you guys are such the example of that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:15:21]:

Working together in different ways, which is what I’m trying to do in a retreat. Right? I’m trying to shake us up. I’m trying to clear our chakras. I’m trying to get us to work together maybe in different groups outside of our normal work groups that we’re in all the time. It’s just a great exercise. I mean, I’m I’m so much more interested in managing a group of people that I wanna hang out with than I am managing a group of people that are just automatons who come into work, clock in for 8 hours and clock

John Garrett [00:15:47]:

out. No. I love it. And they wanna work for someone that cares about them as a person because it’s like, oh, you know, I know you love going to concerts. You went to that concert over the weekend. How was it? You know, show me some pictures. Let’s see the videos, whatever. Because then it’s like, wow.

John Garrett [00:16:00]:

She knows me and not just job title me. That’s incredible. It matters so much.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:16:05]:

I was texting the other day with one of my newer employees, and I was asked it had just occurred to me the last time we talked, she loves plants. And the last time we talked, she had bought a brand new monstera, which are can be really fussy plants. Right? And so I just, out of the blue, texted her. I was like, by the way, what happened with the monstera? And she was telling me, but then she was like, it’s so surreal to get a text from my CEO about my plants in the middle of the day, and I’m like, but I’m so interested in your plant. Like Yeah.

John Garrett [00:16:34]:

Yes. I mean, genuinely. Like, because when she talks about her plant, she’s on I mean, she lights up her eyes and the tone of her voice. Everything’s awesome. And so the more that you’re talking about whatever lights you up, then that energy is gonna come out in your work. Yes. And so why this philosophy at Here Comes the Guide? Did you have a manager before you that was like this or maybe the opposite And you swore to never be like that, or how did this come out?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:17:00]:

You know, I think because for me before I did currently reading, I did in 2008, like, back in the hot and heavy days of blogging. I did a website called Penelope Loves Lists, and it was a blog all about people who were super type a like I am and, like, the type a lifestyle. Right? Uh-huh. And so it it never really went much of anywhere, but what it did do is it gave me a creative outlet that was all mine. Yeah. And so I was so enriched by that experience that I then started talking a lot about this with my colleagues. And, you know, they were seeing me do it, they were cheering me on, and then started doing some of their own things, and it kind of just came from that. And I think it was I think it was really wanting something that was purely creative and very low stakes.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:17:57]:

And then Penelope ended up becoming a lot of what I learned that helped me launch currently

John Garrett [00:18:02]:

reading.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:18:03]:

Yeah. Right, and so then I knew a lot more and I did a lot better the 2nd time, and then currently reading has now grown well beyond what I ever could have expected, but still the core of it is that creativity and doing something really fun, and I take that straight back to Here Comes the Guide. There also is something that more directly, more traditionally has benefited Here Comes the Guide in that in 2020 when we were in the middle because Here Comes the Guide is a website that helps people find their wedding venue. Right? So

John Garrett [00:18:33]:

Yeah.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:18:34]:

We have 65 100 wedding venue clients all over the domestic United States, and then we match couples with those wedding venues. In March of 2020, I don’t know if you heard, but there was a little pandemic get started.

John Garrett [00:18:46]:

Must have just been in Texas. That’s

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:18:48]:

Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. Obviously, the hospitality industry, the wedding industry ground to a halt for a while, right

John Garrett [00:18:56]:

Speaking hammered. Absolutely. To 0. It was amazing.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:19:00]:

This was super scary. Yes. To everybody. Right? And so what I said was, you know what? What we are going to do is, first of all, we’re gonna take care of our venue clients. We’re gonna take care of our couples. That’s the most important thing. But now also what we’re gonna do is we’re gonna find a way to use this time because we never would have had this kind of lull

John Garrett [00:19:22]:

before. Sure.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:19:23]:

Yeah. So we came up with a brand new podcast series, a 10 episode podcast series that was made for our venue clients about helping them use this time to work on their business while they couldn’t work in their business Yeah. And we used all the skills that I had learned from producing a podcast for Currently Reading, and we did it for Here Comes the Guide and packaged it up and gave it to our clients, and it was a huge part of how we were able to love on our venue clients during that time and give them something that was really, really useful. And so that was really impactful to our business, and it came directly because I had the comfort with saying, let’s produce a podcast, and we’ll do 10 episodes, and here’s how we do it, and here’s how we build the website associated with it and here’s how we, you know, RSS out all of that, I could do that because I’d done it with currently reading.

John Garrett [00:20:15]:

Yeah. Because you you exercise that muscle outside of work so many times that then when it’s time to use it at work, it’s like, yeah, let’s just do podcast. And then people are like, wait. You what? And it’s like, yeah. With your 1 arm tied behind your back, you could do it. Exactly. And that’s incredible. That’s awesome.

John Garrett [00:20:30]:

And then too, I mean, you find out, You know, all your people’s ands and and what their some of them wanna make it into a side hustle, which is great. You’re able to help there and the the rest of the team to help with that, and And you ask. I mean, you you just you remember, that’s the plant lady. I wanna ask her about her plant or this is whatever, you know. Like, it’s it’s really that simple, But it just takes, you know, 40 seconds to just be like, hey. Send a quick text. And and the impact on that is is so huge That’s you know, for someone to come back with that’s surreal is it’s like in a good way, which is sad on the state of management in general that this is surreal that someone just asks you about you being human. Right.

John Garrett [00:21:12]:

You know?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:21:12]:

Well, and our hobbies are exactly as you’ve said a 1000000 times, they’re what make us individuals. Right? They’re what make us the individual humans, and there’s nothing that humans want more than to be seen. So what a perfect vehicle to be able to really establish relationship with your employees than to see them in that particular way.

John Garrett [00:21:31]:

And especially because you are fully remote and fully virtual that, you know, then then it’s you have extra intention behind it to make sure that that we’re seeing you because I can’t physically see you on a regular basis.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:21:45]:

One of the fun things that we’ve done at Here Comes the Guide to go back to a question that you asked earlier is that we periodically have all staff get togethers virtually. Right? So we’re on Google Meet, but we’ll have a group of 3 or 4 of us get together and organize whatever we’re gonna do during that time, and what they always do is they’ll pull from what their hobbies are. Right? What they love to do. So we have had, like, group Pilates workouts. We’ve had group HIIT workouts. We’ve had plant tutorial. We’ve had conversations about Bravo TV, various Bravo TV shows. We’ve had so it’s so much fun for the individual staffers to be able to bring that and then have everyone participate in different ways, if we give them a budget to spend on everyone so everyone can participate, it’s so much fun and then we feel as a group like we know that staff are so much better because now we’ve seen them lead a Pilates class or a barre class.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:22:39]:

Now we know intellectually that they do that on their own time, but now we got to see them actually and we’re like, wow. You’re really good. Like, you’re legit with you know? Right? Right? No.

John Garrett [00:22:50]:

It’s it’s for sure. And and even if someone’s not, like, full on legit, they’re alive. Like, they’re they’re super excited about this. And the fact that, like, the people that I work with care enough to ask me to do like, when I did comedy and, you know, doing open mics and stuff, and People that I worked with or around would hear and they would come to the shows, and you’re like, holy cow. This is crazy. Like, this is your free time. Like, you came to this. Like, An open mic comedy is brutal.

John Garrett [00:23:17]:

And so, like, you actually sat through all of this to hear my 5 men. I could’ve done this at the office, you know, but they They came anyway to support and and whatever, and and that means so much, that people

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:23:29]:

care. Did it make you more nervous if people from work were there?

John Garrett [00:23:33]:

Honestly, no. Only because I just felt bad for them because if if some of the other ones, like, that were also at the open mic, I was like, oh, man. This is terrible. Like, I wanna go. Like Great. But now I have to stay because they came. Like, otherwise, I would just Irish exit and just, like, I’m out. Like, I’m just gonna go have a hamburger Or something, Milkshake.

John Garrett [00:23:52]:

But I I was definitely I was just excited that they were there because then it was, like, people that could actually ask for honest feedback where I don’t know anyone else in the audience. But it was more cool. It made me focus more and wanna bring it on a different level than before. But I you know, when you’re doing comedy, I don’t think anything makes you nervous because You’re already doing the hardest thing on the planet. So

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:24:13]:

I was gonna say it’s so brave. It’s so brave.

John Garrett [00:24:16]:

Well, no. I appreciate it. But but I I just love these examples of Of how you you’re running the team and and everyone can do this. It’s not, you know, super hard or complicated or expensive. It just takes a little bit of time and intention and care.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:24:32]:

Well, and people will often say, like, well, doesn’t taking the time to have all 42 of you guys on a Google Meet to do a Pilates class to like, shouldn’t that entire period of time be used for work? And what I always tell them is every single time we grow together as a group, we are more productive and more profitable. So I would put our bottom line up against anybody’s Yeah. Yeah. For pure productivity. And so I just think caring about your employees and seeing them as humans wins the balance sheet every time.

John Garrett [00:25:06]:

I love that so much, and I would 100% agree with you, especially the cost of turnover. That’s stupid expensive. Yes. And people are your greatest asset and the one that people don’t usually invest in at all, And so you’re doing it right. And I and I love to hear that, you know, the bottom line impact is there. So it’s not a make believe Harvard case study kind of thing. It’s legit. Yeah.

John Garrett [00:25:30]:

Yeah. It’s right there. I love that. That’s so awesome. Well, before I wrap this up though, I feel like it’s only fair that we turn the tables And maybe make it since I asked you so many questions at the beginning, we’ll make it the Meredith Monday Schwartz podcast because, obviously, it’s not currently reading. But maybe it will become that. Who knows? You’re the host, so you can ask me whatever you want. I’m in the hot seat.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:25:52]:

Okay. Alright. So just a couple rapid fire ones for you, so Wordle, daily or never?

John Garrett [00:25:59]:

Never. I’ve never done it. I see these things pop up and they got green boxes or I don’t know what. I don’t know how to do it. I don’t even know. So, like, I also don’t have a Mac, so I’m, like, the least cool person on the planet.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:10]:

So then my my next question well, I think I’d know the answer. My next question was Garage Band or Audacity?

John Garrett [00:26:15]:

Oh, Yeah. Audacity.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:17]:

Right. You have no choice on that.

John Garrett [00:26:20]:

PC all the way. Yeah.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:21]:

Exactly. Okay. So when you read, I have to know the answer to the question you asked me. What platform do you read on audiobook, Kindle, print?

John Garrett [00:26:29]:

The traditional book is definitely my favorite. I I’ve grown to appreciate the audiobook now, especially if I’m driving a long distance or on a flight or something like that, but especially the driving or doing a a menial task. Plus, you can, like, 1 and a half speed it on some of the authors, which is great. I would say the the digital book is probably my least one that I that I use. But yeah. I mean, it’s a more traditional book.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:58]:

Yeah. I love a print book. Do you know my podcast partner, Katie, who does currently reading with me, she listens to her audiobooks, I’m not kidding you, at 3 times speed.

John Garrett [00:27:08]:

Wow. That’s

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:09]:

impressive. Have you ever heard a book at 3 times feed

John Garrett [00:27:12]:

That’s like the micro machines man when I was a kid. Like, that gets my butt. I’m sure, subconsciously, your brain is getting it, but What?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:21]:

Well, she says the trick is to move yourself up slowly. Like, you can’t start out there. You have to move yourself up slowly, but I’m a 1.5 girl, a 100%.

John Garrett [00:27:29]:

Yeah. 1.5, maybe 2. There are some authors, you know, where it’s like, alright. Let’s crank this up. Like, did you fall asleep? Or, like, you know, like, what happened? Like, it’s But that’s awesome. Well, very cool. Well, those were super easy.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:40]:

Well, can I ask you one

John Garrett [00:27:41]:

more time? It’s your show. It’s your show. So there you go.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:43]:

Excellent. I like it. Okay. So a lot of people don’t like to answer the question their favorite book of all time because it’s difficult. Right? I got one. Okay.

John Garrett [00:27:50]:

Great. Yeah. So, I would say The War of Art by Steven Pressfield. Hands down, best book ever. Love it so much. And, yeah, such a great book.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:59]:

Yeah. If you wanna get things done in your creative life, no question. Okay. So then the question that people are more comfortable with is what’s the last 5 star book that you read?

John Garrett [00:28:11]:

Oh, easily the last 5 star book that I read was Eckhart Tolle, A New Earth. Really good, deep, spiritual kind of book. As I was reading it or actually, I did the audiobook, and that was one where you have to, like, three x because Eckhart’s a little bit of a slow talker. Okay. But it’s one of those where I was like, how does every high school student not have to read this book? Like, it’s so good. It’s just good, and it makes a lot of things make sense. That’s another book that I’d recommend. It’s almost the opposite of The War of Art where it’s, you know, just an easy read and just, you know, micro chapters and whatever Eckhart, this, you know, a new earth is deep, and you you might have to, like, go back and restart the chapter.

John Garrett [00:28:50]:

I found that happening. I was like, hold on. Wait. Let’s reread that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:28:54]:

Like Well, some of the best books are the ones that demand the most of your

John Garrett [00:28:58]:

attention. Yes. Very much. Because it makes such a big difference. Yeah. Absolutely. I love it. Very good, Meredith.

John Garrett [00:29:03]:

Well, thank you so much for being a part of What’s Your Ann and for just shattering the stereotype of what it means to be a a CEO. So it’s awesome.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:29:10]:

Thank you. I loved

John Garrett [00:29:15]:

it. Very cool. And everybody listening, if you wanna see some pictures of Meredith in action tune on her podcast or some of the books she likes to read or connect with her on social media or better yet, get the link to the currently reading podcast, go to what’s your and dot Calm, everything’s there. And while you’re on the page, please click that big button to the anonymous research survey about corporate culture, and don’t forget to check out the book. So thanks again for subscribing on podcast or whatever app you use and for sharing this with your friends so they get the message that we’re all trying to spread, that who you are is so much more than what you

Apple PodcastsSpotifyPodchaserStitcherOvercastPocketCastsAcastiHeartRadioSoundCloud

Welcome to episode 589 Kind of what’s your and. This is John Garrett. And each Wednesday, I interview a professional who, just like me, is known for a hobby or a passion or an interest outside of work. And to put it another way, it’s encouraging people to find their and, those things above and beyond your technical skills, the things that actually differentiate you when you’re at work. It’s the answer to the question of who else are you beyond the job title. And did you know that pictures of dogs foster social connections amongst people and promote trusting relationships in business settings, I had Michael Puck on. His end was dog photography, and he’s teamed up with others to create global dog art .com. So, check out the website.

John Garrett [00:00:56]:

All the proceeds go to save 1,000,000 dogs by 2030. So check out global dog art.com. And don’t forget to check out the website, what’s your and.com. Links to the award winning book are there and also to all the guest episodes. And please don’t forget to subscribe to the podcast so you don’t miss any of the future stories. I love sharing them each and every week, and this week is no different with my guest, Meredith Monday Schwartz. She’s the CEO of Here Comes the Guide and the host of the Currently Reading podcast, and now she’s with me here today. Meredith, thanks so much for taking time to be with me on What’s Your End?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:01:30]:

Oh, John, I am ridiculously excited to talk about these topics with you.

John Garrett [00:01:34]:

That’s awesome. Me too. So, like, let’s do we’ll jump in. But first, we have, rapid fire questions, get to know Meredith out of the gate here. And maybe an easy one. I don’t know. We’ll see a favorite Disney character.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:01:46]:

Oh, definitely Belle from Beauty and the Beast. Oh, okay. She is like me, a reader at heart, and I I love Belle.

John Garrett [00:01:54]:

Yeah. No. Solid answer. Solid answer. How about when it comes to puzzles? Sudoku, crossword, jigsaw puzzle, I guess Wordle? I’ll take that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:02]:

I love jigsaw puzzles because I can listen to an audiobook while I do. Oh, okay. There you go. There you go. I like it. Okay. How about a favorite color? Oh, peacock

John Garrett [00:02:11]:

blue. Oh, solid answer.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:14]:

Yeah. That’s my signature color.

John Garrett [00:02:16]:

Yes. Yeah. I like that. That’s a good color. How about a least favorite color?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:21]:

Oh, like a baby vomit green. There you go. Alright.

John Garrett [00:02:28]:

That’s it’s hard to argue that. Like, when vomit’s in the name,

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:30]:

it’s like, it’s not gonna

John Garrett [00:02:32]:

be good. Itself. Right. It’s not gonna be good. Not gonna be good. Oh, here’s a fun one. How about your first concert?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:39]:

Fine young cannibals. Oh my goodness. Yes. I’d so dated myself. Right

John Garrett [00:02:45]:

No. That’s awesome. Very good. You were 5. Your parents brought you. Who knows? Like, you

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:50]:

told me. In a stroller.

John Garrett [00:02:52]:

Right? That’s incredible. Wow. Okay. How about a favorite actor or an actress?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:58]:

You know, I love Octavia Spencer. I’ve been watching her latest, truth be told on Apple TV, and it is a fantastic, like, true crime drama. It’s about a podcaster. Oh, yeah. It’s really, really good, and I just love Octavia

John Garrett [00:03:13]:

Spencer. Very good. Very good. I love it. How about, this one’s an important one, toilet paper roll over or under?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:20]:

Okay, I’m gonna shock everybody out there, and I’m gonna say under. My baby’s always wanted to, like, grab it and pull, and when it’s coming from over, it’s so easy to make a mess.

John Garrett [00:03:30]:

It never stops.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:31]:

Yeah. Exactly. So under for me.

John Garrett [00:03:34]:

Okay. Okay. Well, at least there’s some logic there.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:36]:

Yes.

John Garrett [00:03:37]:

How about, Star Wars or Star Trek?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:40]:

Star Trek Next Generation all the way.

John Garrett [00:03:43]:

Oh, okay. Very specific even. Yeah. Alright. There you go. I do find that, like yeah. People that say Star Wars, it’s just Star Wars in general, but Star Trek, they wanna narrow down, like, which specific Series or movie or whatever.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:57]:

Yeah. Witch captain, and I’m Jean Luc. Yes.

John Garrett [00:04:00]:

There you go. How about your computer? More of a PC or a Mac?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:04]:

Only Max, Max all the

John Garrett [00:04:05]:

time. Okay. Alright. How about pens or pencils? Pens. Yeah? Yeah. You don’t make a mistake, so I like it. That’s good.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:14]:

I like a a really specific pen. I only use 1 particular pen, and so yeah. That’s why I stumbled because I was like, well, but there’s only 1 pen, so it’s okay.

John Garrett [00:04:26]:

So pen or pencils? I actually been the question. Right. There you go. Alright. Alright. I love ice cream. Do you have any favorite ice cream flavor?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:33]:

Ben and Jerry’s New York Super Fudge Chunk.

John Garrett [00:04:36]:

Yes. I I’m a huge fan of the chunks Yes. And ice cream. It’s it just it’s more efficient in getting more calories into my face.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:43]:

The more the more texture, the

John Garrett [00:04:46]:

better. Yes. Absolutely. I’m a 100% with this. How about a favorite day of the week?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:51]:

Well, I have to go with Monday. I am a Monday. Monday is my maiden

John Garrett [00:04:54]:

name. That is. Oh, there you go.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:56]:

Alright. Alright. That that works.

John Garrett [00:04:58]:

How about oceans or mountains? Mountains. Mountains. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I’m just kinda spoiled in Colorado, so they’re just right outside.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:07]:

Right and I grew up in California. So Oh. Which year we have beautiful oceans and mountains, but late the Lake Tahoe area is my favorite area. Yeah.

John Garrett [00:05:17]:

So beautiful. Yeah. That’s amazing. Yeah. Tahoe is nice. Really nice. How about a favorite number? 7. 7.

John Garrett [00:05:23]:

A reason?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:25]:

Just always been a good luck number for

John Garrett [00:05:27]:

me. Yeah. It’s a good number. Absolutely. 2 more or 3 more rather. Books, audio version, ebook, or real book?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:34]:

Yeah. This is a very difficult rapid fire

John Garrett [00:05:37]:

question for me because No. No. For sure.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:38]:

Could go

John Garrett [00:05:39]:

do that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:40]:

All of them. But on my actual spreadsheet, I will tell you right now, I’m at 65% of my reading this year is on Kindle Oasis.

John Garrett [00:05:49]:

Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. Alright. That’s more than I

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:52]:

anticipated. Yes. And it’s grown a lot since I got the oasis in

John Garrett [00:05:56]:

particular. Oh, okay. Alright. Alright. How about, favorite toppings on a pizza? You can load it up.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:03]:

Pepperoni and

John Garrett [00:06:04]:

pineapple. Oh, and but I never done the, 2 piece together. I like that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:08]:

That is the best.

John Garrett [00:06:10]:

Interesting because it’s always ham and

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:11]:

pineapple. No. You gotta go with pepperoni and pineapple.

John Garrett [00:06:14]:

Yeah. Okay. Alright. And the last The favorite thing you own or the favorite thing you

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:19]:

have? You know, my most prized possession is my wedding ring, which is funny because it’s just my husband and I wear matching pants. They were $40 each. They’re worth nothing financially. Sure. But that is the thing that I would be the most, like, outsizably upset if I were to lose it unexpectedly.

John Garrett [00:06:37]:

Yeah. No. I just totally understand. But the great thing is you can just grab his, and then he thinks he lost

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:41]:

his. No.

John Garrett [00:06:41]:

And then you’re like

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:44]:

right, you just share 1 back and forth. Right? Right. Right. No.

John Garrett [00:06:47]:

No. That’s awesome answer though because it’s so sentimental and and means so much. So That’s that’s awesome. Well, let’s jump into podcasting and, I mean, just, you know, of course, being the host of the Currently Reading podcast. So I’m sure it’s, you know, obviously about books that you’re reading because it’s right there on the name. So but but how did you get into the podcasting side of it?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:07:09]:

Reading’s been my main hobby since I could read. I was one of those kids who was always under the covers with a flashlight reading or under the dining room table, you know, trying to read and get everyone not to bother me, that’s always been kind of my identity. And then as, you know, social media came about, all of a sudden, there was a way for those of us who love to read more than anything, to find each other, which is absolutely fantastic. So I got involved in a book group and got to be really good friends with the woman who’s now my podcast partner, Katie Cobb, and we just had never met in real life. I had never even heard her voice. But we got to talking one day and I was like, I have this idea for a podcast. It’s 2 people talking about literally the 3 books they read most currently whether they like them or not. And this was the thing that I really wanted to do because nobody else was doing it in the book space.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:08:01]:

Nobody was actually talking about a book if it didn’t work for them. And so I wanted to talk about books. I wanted to see who wanted to listen to us talk about books. So in 2018, we got started and we just ended our 5th

John Garrett [00:08:14]:

season. Oh, congratulations. That’s incredible.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:08:17]:

I know. And we we have so much fun. We have a really formatted show. We keep it really tight. We don’t go down, like, discussive rabbit holes. We keep it really tight. It’s really about the books. And yeah.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:08:28]:

We just have had so much fun. It’s something I always look forward to. It’s a lot of work, but it has brought so much joy to my life as well as bringing a lot to my day job at Here Comes the Guide too.

John Garrett [00:08:41]:

Oh, that’s incredible. That’s awesome. Yeah. Because, I mean, That’s not the reason you did it, obviously, was what else will make me better at my career. It was more of, like, I am crazy about books And I found someone else also equally crazy about books and reads more than 3 because you obviously have to have the last 3 that you read. You can’t talk about Same 3 every offer for a year.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:09:01]:

Exactly. So we had to right. We read a lot. And so one of the things that we said at the very beginning was because we didn’t set the podcast up to be any sort of business. We weren’t gonna have a Patreon. We weren’t gonna do anything. We said, if we can just get 10 people who regularly want to listen, then that’ll be enough because all we wanna do is talk about books. And I actually think that’s the single best decision that we made was to not make it about any sort of result or metric.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:09:32]:

Trick, and in my day job, everything is about profit and all the different KPIs. Right? We love a metric. Yep. Currently Reading was a pure passion play, and that enabled us to make a lot of decisions where we didn’t have to think about some of the things you think about when money is at issue, and I think that made us

John Garrett [00:09:52]:

better. Yeah. It’s just it’s liberating because you’re you’re not playing it so safe. The the guardrails aren’t up because it doesn’t matter. Right. I mean, you know, you’re not Oprah where A 1000000000 people are listening, and, you know, at the beginning. So it’s like, well, let’s just swing for the fences every time. Why not? You know? And then and then it just You’re freer and that comes out.

John Garrett [00:10:12]:

Like, people can hear it, and and I love that. You know? It created that space for you to be able to be That. You know, take the guardrails off and and just be you instead of, you know, in the executive space where, well, you know, a little bit of guardrail helps Bad times.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:10:28]:

Right. And I tend toward not I tend toward. I’m I’m a perfectionist. I’m very I am such a perfectionist. And currently reading gave me the ability just like you said to be like, you know what? Let’s just try it and see what happens, or let me just, on the mic, be exactly who I am. And if people don’t all love who I am on the mic, that’s okay. Yeah. And that has been really helpful to me in kind of pushing out some of those walls around my comfort zone.

John Garrett [00:11:02]:

Yeah. And and that’s such a great point too of of how, you know, the the fear of being who we are at work. You know, we we Leave so many pieces of us outside the office because, well, we this has nothing to do with my job or people aren’t gonna care or what it’s like, no. No. You’re you. The leadership hired you as a human, and there’s other dimensions to you besides the technical skills part, And it’s important for that. And and so as a as a leader of an organization, how much does it matter to you that people have ands, that they you even learn what they are or that they explore them.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:11:39]:

Right. And this is something I think surprises people when they start to work for us. This is something that we definitely want to amplify in all of our employees. This is something like, if we wanna know what people do what they love doing, what lights them up. And if they have something that they wanna take from a hobby to a side hustle, we actually have I actually work with my employees, if that’s something that they wanna do, we encourage hobbies just for the sake of hobbies. But if they want to or what they love outside of work and kind of grow something into a side hustle, I actually work with them 1 on 1. We have a 4 day work week at Here Comes the Guide, so we only work Monday through Thursday? Yeah. And so on Fridays, I oftentimes will be meeting with 1 or the other member of my staff to really talk through how to grow A Side Hustle from Start to Profit.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:12:30]:

Right? And so they’re always surprised that it’s something not only that we’re okay with, but it’s something that we really love because time and time again, you know better than anyone, the people who have hobbies that they really love or things that they’re doing that Sharpen Their Saw, it makes them fresher, more creative, and better at their work for Here Comes the Guide. So I’m all about it with my employees.

John Garrett [00:12:55]:

Yeah. I love that. That’s so awesome. And so do you just ask them, or is it part of the onboarding process or the interviewing process or because, I mean, it is that simple if you just ask, but I know a lot of people listening and they’re like, well, how do you find out?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:13:10]:

Right. Well, there’s 42 of us. It’s 42 women and we have a super flat management structure, so my COO and I actually know every one of our employees really, really well. We spend a lot of time getting to know them and as individuals within our group and within their skill sets within our group, but also, you know, we shoot the s h a lot. Like, we we we really, like I mean, this is something that we take really seriously is the whole ethos around Here Comes the Guide is about being the best version of yourself inside and outside of work. So there’s no, like, work version of Meredith and home version of Meredith. It’s all 1 person and so we think about that. I think about that with everyone who works for me.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:13:55]:

So we get to know each other really well. I have you know, when people find out that I have a book podcast, I will often have people come into my virtual office. We’re fully remote, so we’re we’re all virtual, but they’ll knock on my virtual door and be like, I don’t know what book I should read next, and we’ll spend 30 minutes talking about books. And so I have multiple staffers who have incredible hobbies or side hustles outside of work and we love to talk about it. The other thing is when we have retreats, oftentimes, I like to mix up what we’re working on. I don’t wanna work on here comes the guide work at a retreat because that’s what we do all the time. So sometimes we’ll take some of the side hustle stuff, use it as a creative exercise, and kind of brainstorm together all 42 of us to talk about 1 person’s side hustle and how they can amplify it, and that’s something that we love to do together too.

John Garrett [00:14:46]:

Yeah. And that oh, man. These are such great examples of caring about the person that works for Here Comes the Guide. You know, you hired a person, not an analyst or a marketer or whatever their role is. You hired a human. And, you know, what’s the difference between sending them to technical skills training and the difference to, you know, having a retreat where we pour All of our knowledge into your hobby or, you know, side hustle. We’re making you a better person, and you’re you’re living your best life. You’re gonna do your best work, And you guys are such the example of that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:15:21]:

Working together in different ways, which is what I’m trying to do in a retreat. Right? I’m trying to shake us up. I’m trying to clear our chakras. I’m trying to get us to work together maybe in different groups outside of our normal work groups that we’re in all the time. It’s just a great exercise. I mean, I’m I’m so much more interested in managing a group of people that I wanna hang out with than I am managing a group of people that are just automatons who come into work, clock in for 8 hours and clock

John Garrett [00:15:47]:

out. No. I love it. And they wanna work for someone that cares about them as a person because it’s like, oh, you know, I know you love going to concerts. You went to that concert over the weekend. How was it? You know, show me some pictures. Let’s see the videos, whatever. Because then it’s like, wow.

John Garrett [00:16:00]:

She knows me and not just job title me. That’s incredible. It matters so much.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:16:05]:

I was texting the other day with one of my newer employees, and I was asked it had just occurred to me the last time we talked, she loves plants. And the last time we talked, she had bought a brand new monstera, which are can be really fussy plants. Right? And so I just, out of the blue, texted her. I was like, by the way, what happened with the monstera? And she was telling me, but then she was like, it’s so surreal to get a text from my CEO about my plants in the middle of the day, and I’m like, but I’m so interested in your plant. Like Yeah.

John Garrett [00:16:34]:

Yes. I mean, genuinely. Like, because when she talks about her plant, she’s on I mean, she lights up her eyes and the tone of her voice. Everything’s awesome. And so the more that you’re talking about whatever lights you up, then that energy is gonna come out in your work. Yes. And so why this philosophy at Here Comes the Guide? Did you have a manager before you that was like this or maybe the opposite And you swore to never be like that, or how did this come out?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:17:00]:

You know, I think because for me before I did currently reading, I did in 2008, like, back in the hot and heavy days of blogging. I did a website called Penelope Loves Lists, and it was a blog all about people who were super type a like I am and, like, the type a lifestyle. Right? Uh-huh. And so it it never really went much of anywhere, but what it did do is it gave me a creative outlet that was all mine. Yeah. And so I was so enriched by that experience that I then started talking a lot about this with my colleagues. And, you know, they were seeing me do it, they were cheering me on, and then started doing some of their own things, and it kind of just came from that. And I think it was I think it was really wanting something that was purely creative and very low stakes.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:17:57]:

And then Penelope ended up becoming a lot of what I learned that helped me launch currently

John Garrett [00:18:02]:

reading.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:18:03]:

Yeah. Right, and so then I knew a lot more and I did a lot better the 2nd time, and then currently reading has now grown well beyond what I ever could have expected, but still the core of it is that creativity and doing something really fun, and I take that straight back to Here Comes the Guide. There also is something that more directly, more traditionally has benefited Here Comes the Guide in that in 2020 when we were in the middle because Here Comes the Guide is a website that helps people find their wedding venue. Right? So

John Garrett [00:18:33]:

Yeah.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:18:34]:

We have 65 100 wedding venue clients all over the domestic United States, and then we match couples with those wedding venues. In March of 2020, I don’t know if you heard, but there was a little pandemic get started.

John Garrett [00:18:46]:

Must have just been in Texas. That’s

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:18:48]:

Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. Obviously, the hospitality industry, the wedding industry ground to a halt for a while, right

John Garrett [00:18:56]:

Speaking hammered. Absolutely. To 0. It was amazing.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:19:00]:

This was super scary. Yes. To everybody. Right? And so what I said was, you know what? What we are going to do is, first of all, we’re gonna take care of our venue clients. We’re gonna take care of our couples. That’s the most important thing. But now also what we’re gonna do is we’re gonna find a way to use this time because we never would have had this kind of lull

John Garrett [00:19:22]:

before. Sure.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:19:23]:

Yeah. So we came up with a brand new podcast series, a 10 episode podcast series that was made for our venue clients about helping them use this time to work on their business while they couldn’t work in their business Yeah. And we used all the skills that I had learned from producing a podcast for Currently Reading, and we did it for Here Comes the Guide and packaged it up and gave it to our clients, and it was a huge part of how we were able to love on our venue clients during that time and give them something that was really, really useful. And so that was really impactful to our business, and it came directly because I had the comfort with saying, let’s produce a podcast, and we’ll do 10 episodes, and here’s how we do it, and here’s how we build the website associated with it and here’s how we, you know, RSS out all of that, I could do that because I’d done it with currently reading.

John Garrett [00:20:15]:

Yeah. Because you you exercise that muscle outside of work so many times that then when it’s time to use it at work, it’s like, yeah, let’s just do podcast. And then people are like, wait. You what? And it’s like, yeah. With your 1 arm tied behind your back, you could do it. Exactly. And that’s incredible. That’s awesome.

John Garrett [00:20:30]:

And then too, I mean, you find out, You know, all your people’s ands and and what their some of them wanna make it into a side hustle, which is great. You’re able to help there and the the rest of the team to help with that, and And you ask. I mean, you you just you remember, that’s the plant lady. I wanna ask her about her plant or this is whatever, you know. Like, it’s it’s really that simple, But it just takes, you know, 40 seconds to just be like, hey. Send a quick text. And and the impact on that is is so huge That’s you know, for someone to come back with that’s surreal is it’s like in a good way, which is sad on the state of management in general that this is surreal that someone just asks you about you being human. Right.

John Garrett [00:21:12]:

You know?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:21:12]:

Well, and our hobbies are exactly as you’ve said a 1000000 times, they’re what make us individuals. Right? They’re what make us the individual humans, and there’s nothing that humans want more than to be seen. So what a perfect vehicle to be able to really establish relationship with your employees than to see them in that particular way.

John Garrett [00:21:31]:

And especially because you are fully remote and fully virtual that, you know, then then it’s you have extra intention behind it to make sure that that we’re seeing you because I can’t physically see you on a regular basis.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:21:45]:

One of the fun things that we’ve done at Here Comes the Guide to go back to a question that you asked earlier is that we periodically have all staff get togethers virtually. Right? So we’re on Google Meet, but we’ll have a group of 3 or 4 of us get together and organize whatever we’re gonna do during that time, and what they always do is they’ll pull from what their hobbies are. Right? What they love to do. So we have had, like, group Pilates workouts. We’ve had group HIIT workouts. We’ve had plant tutorial. We’ve had conversations about Bravo TV, various Bravo TV shows. We’ve had so it’s so much fun for the individual staffers to be able to bring that and then have everyone participate in different ways, if we give them a budget to spend on everyone so everyone can participate, it’s so much fun and then we feel as a group like we know that staff are so much better because now we’ve seen them lead a Pilates class or a barre class.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:22:39]:

Now we know intellectually that they do that on their own time, but now we got to see them actually and we’re like, wow. You’re really good. Like, you’re legit with you know? Right? Right? No.

John Garrett [00:22:50]:

It’s it’s for sure. And and even if someone’s not, like, full on legit, they’re alive. Like, they’re they’re super excited about this. And the fact that, like, the people that I work with care enough to ask me to do like, when I did comedy and, you know, doing open mics and stuff, and People that I worked with or around would hear and they would come to the shows, and you’re like, holy cow. This is crazy. Like, this is your free time. Like, you came to this. Like, An open mic comedy is brutal.

John Garrett [00:23:17]:

And so, like, you actually sat through all of this to hear my 5 men. I could’ve done this at the office, you know, but they They came anyway to support and and whatever, and and that means so much, that people

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:23:29]:

care. Did it make you more nervous if people from work were there?

John Garrett [00:23:33]:

Honestly, no. Only because I just felt bad for them because if if some of the other ones, like, that were also at the open mic, I was like, oh, man. This is terrible. Like, I wanna go. Like Great. But now I have to stay because they came. Like, otherwise, I would just Irish exit and just, like, I’m out. Like, I’m just gonna go have a hamburger Or something, Milkshake.

John Garrett [00:23:52]:

But I I was definitely I was just excited that they were there because then it was, like, people that could actually ask for honest feedback where I don’t know anyone else in the audience. But it was more cool. It made me focus more and wanna bring it on a different level than before. But I you know, when you’re doing comedy, I don’t think anything makes you nervous because You’re already doing the hardest thing on the planet. So

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:24:13]:

I was gonna say it’s so brave. It’s so brave.

John Garrett [00:24:16]:

Well, no. I appreciate it. But but I I just love these examples of Of how you you’re running the team and and everyone can do this. It’s not, you know, super hard or complicated or expensive. It just takes a little bit of time and intention and care.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:24:32]:

Well, and people will often say, like, well, doesn’t taking the time to have all 42 of you guys on a Google Meet to do a Pilates class to like, shouldn’t that entire period of time be used for work? And what I always tell them is every single time we grow together as a group, we are more productive and more profitable. So I would put our bottom line up against anybody’s Yeah. Yeah. For pure productivity. And so I just think caring about your employees and seeing them as humans wins the balance sheet every time.

John Garrett [00:25:06]:

I love that so much, and I would 100% agree with you, especially the cost of turnover. That’s stupid expensive. Yes. And people are your greatest asset and the one that people don’t usually invest in at all, And so you’re doing it right. And I and I love to hear that, you know, the bottom line impact is there. So it’s not a make believe Harvard case study kind of thing. It’s legit. Yeah.

John Garrett [00:25:30]:

Yeah. It’s right there. I love that. That’s so awesome. Well, before I wrap this up though, I feel like it’s only fair that we turn the tables And maybe make it since I asked you so many questions at the beginning, we’ll make it the Meredith Monday Schwartz podcast because, obviously, it’s not currently reading. But maybe it will become that. Who knows? You’re the host, so you can ask me whatever you want. I’m in the hot seat.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:25:52]:

Okay. Alright. So just a couple rapid fire ones for you, so Wordle, daily or never?

John Garrett [00:25:59]:

Never. I’ve never done it. I see these things pop up and they got green boxes or I don’t know what. I don’t know how to do it. I don’t even know. So, like, I also don’t have a Mac, so I’m, like, the least cool person on the planet.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:10]:

So then my my next question well, I think I’d know the answer. My next question was Garage Band or Audacity?

John Garrett [00:26:15]:

Oh, Yeah. Audacity.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:17]:

Right. You have no choice on that.

John Garrett [00:26:20]:

PC all the way. Yeah.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:21]:

Exactly. Okay. So when you read, I have to know the answer to the question you asked me. What platform do you read on audiobook, Kindle, print?

John Garrett [00:26:29]:

The traditional book is definitely my favorite. I I’ve grown to appreciate the audiobook now, especially if I’m driving a long distance or on a flight or something like that, but especially the driving or doing a a menial task. Plus, you can, like, 1 and a half speed it on some of the authors, which is great. I would say the the digital book is probably my least one that I that I use. But yeah. I mean, it’s a more traditional book.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:58]:

Yeah. I love a print book. Do you know my podcast partner, Katie, who does currently reading with me, she listens to her audiobooks, I’m not kidding you, at 3 times speed.

John Garrett [00:27:08]:

Wow. That’s

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:09]:

impressive. Have you ever heard a book at 3 times feed

John Garrett [00:27:12]:

That’s like the micro machines man when I was a kid. Like, that gets my butt. I’m sure, subconsciously, your brain is getting it, but What?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:21]:

Well, she says the trick is to move yourself up slowly. Like, you can’t start out there. You have to move yourself up slowly, but I’m a 1.5 girl, a 100%.

John Garrett [00:27:29]:

Yeah. 1.5, maybe 2. There are some authors, you know, where it’s like, alright. Let’s crank this up. Like, did you fall asleep? Or, like, you know, like, what happened? Like, it’s But that’s awesome. Well, very cool. Well, those were super easy.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:40]:

Well, can I ask you one

John Garrett [00:27:41]:

more time? It’s your show. It’s your show. So there you go.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:43]:

Excellent. I like it. Okay. So a lot of people don’t like to answer the question their favorite book of all time because it’s difficult. Right? I got one. Okay.

John Garrett [00:27:50]:

Great. Yeah. So, I would say The War of Art by Steven Pressfield. Hands down, best book ever. Love it so much. And, yeah, such a great book.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:59]:

Yeah. If you wanna get things done in your creative life, no question. Okay. So then the question that people are more comfortable with is what’s the last 5 star book that you read?

John Garrett [00:28:11]:

Oh, easily the last 5 star book that I read was Eckhart Tolle, A New Earth. Really good, deep, spiritual kind of book. As I was reading it or actually, I did the audiobook, and that was one where you have to, like, three x because Eckhart’s a little bit of a slow talker. Okay. But it’s one of those where I was like, how does every high school student not have to read this book? Like, it’s so good. It’s just good, and it makes a lot of things make sense. That’s another book that I’d recommend. It’s almost the opposite of The War of Art where it’s, you know, just an easy read and just, you know, micro chapters and whatever Eckhart, this, you know, a new earth is deep, and you you might have to, like, go back and restart the chapter.

John Garrett [00:28:50]:

I found that happening. I was like, hold on. Wait. Let’s reread that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:28:54]:

Like Well, some of the best books are the ones that demand the most of your

John Garrett [00:28:58]:

attention. Yes. Very much. Because it makes such a big difference. Yeah. Absolutely. I love it. Very good, Meredith.

John Garrett [00:29:03]:

Well, thank you so much for being a part of What’s Your Ann and for just shattering the stereotype of what it means to be a a CEO. So it’s awesome.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:29:10]:

Thank you. I loved

John Garrett [00:29:15]:

it. Very cool. And everybody listening, if you wanna see some pictures of Meredith in action tune on her podcast or some of the books she likes to read or connect with her on social media or better yet, get the link to the currently reading podcast, go to what’s your and dot Calm, everything’s there. And while you’re on the page, please click that big button to the anonymous research survey about corporate culture, and don’t forget to check out the book. So thanks again for subscribing on podcast or whatever app you use and for sharing this with your friends so they get the message that we’re all trying to spread, that who you are is so much more than what you

Apple PodcastsSpotifyPodchaserStitcherOvercastPocketCastsAcastiHeartRadioSoundCloud

Welcome to episode 589 Kind of what’s your and. This is John Garrett. And each Wednesday, I interview a professional who, just like me, is known for a hobby or a passion or an interest outside of work. And to put it another way, it’s encouraging people to find their and, those things above and beyond your technical skills, the things that actually differentiate you when you’re at work. It’s the answer to the question of who else are you beyond the job title. And did you know that pictures of dogs foster social connections amongst people and promote trusting relationships in business settings, I had Michael Puck on. His end was dog photography, and he’s teamed up with others to create global dog art .com. So, check out the website.

John Garrett [00:00:56]:

All the proceeds go to save 1,000,000 dogs by 2030. So check out global dog art.com. And don’t forget to check out the website, what’s your and.com. Links to the award winning book are there and also to all the guest episodes. And please don’t forget to subscribe to the podcast so you don’t miss any of the future stories. I love sharing them each and every week, and this week is no different with my guest, Meredith Monday Schwartz. She’s the CEO of Here Comes the Guide and the host of the Currently Reading podcast, and now she’s with me here today. Meredith, thanks so much for taking time to be with me on What’s Your End?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:01:30]:

Oh, John, I am ridiculously excited to talk about these topics with you.

John Garrett [00:01:34]:

That’s awesome. Me too. So, like, let’s do we’ll jump in. But first, we have, rapid fire questions, get to know Meredith out of the gate here. And maybe an easy one. I don’t know. We’ll see a favorite Disney character.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:01:46]:

Oh, definitely Belle from Beauty and the Beast. Oh, okay. She is like me, a reader at heart, and I I love Belle.

John Garrett [00:01:54]:

Yeah. No. Solid answer. Solid answer. How about when it comes to puzzles? Sudoku, crossword, jigsaw puzzle, I guess Wordle? I’ll take that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:02]:

I love jigsaw puzzles because I can listen to an audiobook while I do. Oh, okay. There you go. There you go. I like it. Okay. How about a favorite color? Oh, peacock

John Garrett [00:02:11]:

blue. Oh, solid answer.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:14]:

Yeah. That’s my signature color.

John Garrett [00:02:16]:

Yes. Yeah. I like that. That’s a good color. How about a least favorite color?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:21]:

Oh, like a baby vomit green. There you go. Alright.

John Garrett [00:02:28]:

That’s it’s hard to argue that. Like, when vomit’s in the name,

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:30]:

it’s like, it’s not gonna

John Garrett [00:02:32]:

be good. Itself. Right. It’s not gonna be good. Not gonna be good. Oh, here’s a fun one. How about your first concert?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:39]:

Fine young cannibals. Oh my goodness. Yes. I’d so dated myself. Right

John Garrett [00:02:45]:

No. That’s awesome. Very good. You were 5. Your parents brought you. Who knows? Like, you

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:50]:

told me. In a stroller.

John Garrett [00:02:52]:

Right? That’s incredible. Wow. Okay. How about a favorite actor or an actress?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:02:58]:

You know, I love Octavia Spencer. I’ve been watching her latest, truth be told on Apple TV, and it is a fantastic, like, true crime drama. It’s about a podcaster. Oh, yeah. It’s really, really good, and I just love Octavia

John Garrett [00:03:13]:

Spencer. Very good. Very good. I love it. How about, this one’s an important one, toilet paper roll over or under?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:20]:

Okay, I’m gonna shock everybody out there, and I’m gonna say under. My baby’s always wanted to, like, grab it and pull, and when it’s coming from over, it’s so easy to make a mess.

John Garrett [00:03:30]:

It never stops.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:31]:

Yeah. Exactly. So under for me.

John Garrett [00:03:34]:

Okay. Okay. Well, at least there’s some logic there.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:36]:

Yes.

John Garrett [00:03:37]:

How about, Star Wars or Star Trek?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:40]:

Star Trek Next Generation all the way.

John Garrett [00:03:43]:

Oh, okay. Very specific even. Yeah. Alright. There you go. I do find that, like yeah. People that say Star Wars, it’s just Star Wars in general, but Star Trek, they wanna narrow down, like, which specific Series or movie or whatever.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:03:57]:

Yeah. Witch captain, and I’m Jean Luc. Yes.

John Garrett [00:04:00]:

There you go. How about your computer? More of a PC or a Mac?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:04]:

Only Max, Max all the

John Garrett [00:04:05]:

time. Okay. Alright. How about pens or pencils? Pens. Yeah? Yeah. You don’t make a mistake, so I like it. That’s good.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:14]:

I like a a really specific pen. I only use 1 particular pen, and so yeah. That’s why I stumbled because I was like, well, but there’s only 1 pen, so it’s okay.

John Garrett [00:04:26]:

So pen or pencils? I actually been the question. Right. There you go. Alright. Alright. I love ice cream. Do you have any favorite ice cream flavor?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:33]:

Ben and Jerry’s New York Super Fudge Chunk.

John Garrett [00:04:36]:

Yes. I I’m a huge fan of the chunks Yes. And ice cream. It’s it just it’s more efficient in getting more calories into my face.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:43]:

The more the more texture, the

John Garrett [00:04:46]:

better. Yes. Absolutely. I’m a 100% with this. How about a favorite day of the week?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:51]:

Well, I have to go with Monday. I am a Monday. Monday is my maiden

John Garrett [00:04:54]:

name. That is. Oh, there you go.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:04:56]:

Alright. Alright. That that works.

John Garrett [00:04:58]:

How about oceans or mountains? Mountains. Mountains. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I’m just kinda spoiled in Colorado, so they’re just right outside.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:07]:

Right and I grew up in California. So Oh. Which year we have beautiful oceans and mountains, but late the Lake Tahoe area is my favorite area. Yeah.

John Garrett [00:05:17]:

So beautiful. Yeah. That’s amazing. Yeah. Tahoe is nice. Really nice. How about a favorite number? 7. 7.

John Garrett [00:05:23]:

A reason?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:25]:

Just always been a good luck number for

John Garrett [00:05:27]:

me. Yeah. It’s a good number. Absolutely. 2 more or 3 more rather. Books, audio version, ebook, or real book?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:34]:

Yeah. This is a very difficult rapid fire

John Garrett [00:05:37]:

question for me because No. No. For sure.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:38]:

Could go

John Garrett [00:05:39]:

do that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:40]:

All of them. But on my actual spreadsheet, I will tell you right now, I’m at 65% of my reading this year is on Kindle Oasis.

John Garrett [00:05:49]:

Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. Alright. That’s more than I

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:05:52]:

anticipated. Yes. And it’s grown a lot since I got the oasis in

John Garrett [00:05:56]:

particular. Oh, okay. Alright. Alright. How about, favorite toppings on a pizza? You can load it up.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:03]:

Pepperoni and

John Garrett [00:06:04]:

pineapple. Oh, and but I never done the, 2 piece together. I like that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:08]:

That is the best.

John Garrett [00:06:10]:

Interesting because it’s always ham and

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:11]:

pineapple. No. You gotta go with pepperoni and pineapple.

John Garrett [00:06:14]:

Yeah. Okay. Alright. And the last The favorite thing you own or the favorite thing you

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:19]:

have? You know, my most prized possession is my wedding ring, which is funny because it’s just my husband and I wear matching pants. They were $40 each. They’re worth nothing financially. Sure. But that is the thing that I would be the most, like, outsizably upset if I were to lose it unexpectedly.

John Garrett [00:06:37]:

Yeah. No. I just totally understand. But the great thing is you can just grab his, and then he thinks he lost

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:41]:

his. No.

John Garrett [00:06:41]:

And then you’re like

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:06:44]:

right, you just share 1 back and forth. Right? Right. Right. No.

John Garrett [00:06:47]:

No. That’s awesome answer though because it’s so sentimental and and means so much. So That’s that’s awesome. Well, let’s jump into podcasting and, I mean, just, you know, of course, being the host of the Currently Reading podcast. So I’m sure it’s, you know, obviously about books that you’re reading because it’s right there on the name. So but but how did you get into the podcasting side of it?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:07:09]:

Reading’s been my main hobby since I could read. I was one of those kids who was always under the covers with a flashlight reading or under the dining room table, you know, trying to read and get everyone not to bother me, that’s always been kind of my identity. And then as, you know, social media came about, all of a sudden, there was a way for those of us who love to read more than anything, to find each other, which is absolutely fantastic. So I got involved in a book group and got to be really good friends with the woman who’s now my podcast partner, Katie Cobb, and we just had never met in real life. I had never even heard her voice. But we got to talking one day and I was like, I have this idea for a podcast. It’s 2 people talking about literally the 3 books they read most currently whether they like them or not. And this was the thing that I really wanted to do because nobody else was doing it in the book space.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:08:01]:

Nobody was actually talking about a book if it didn’t work for them. And so I wanted to talk about books. I wanted to see who wanted to listen to us talk about books. So in 2018, we got started and we just ended our 5th

John Garrett [00:08:14]:

season. Oh, congratulations. That’s incredible.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:08:17]:

I know. And we we have so much fun. We have a really formatted show. We keep it really tight. We don’t go down, like, discussive rabbit holes. We keep it really tight. It’s really about the books. And yeah.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:08:28]:

We just have had so much fun. It’s something I always look forward to. It’s a lot of work, but it has brought so much joy to my life as well as bringing a lot to my day job at Here Comes the Guide too.

John Garrett [00:08:41]:

Oh, that’s incredible. That’s awesome. Yeah. Because, I mean, That’s not the reason you did it, obviously, was what else will make me better at my career. It was more of, like, I am crazy about books And I found someone else also equally crazy about books and reads more than 3 because you obviously have to have the last 3 that you read. You can’t talk about Same 3 every offer for a year.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:09:01]:

Exactly. So we had to right. We read a lot. And so one of the things that we said at the very beginning was because we didn’t set the podcast up to be any sort of business. We weren’t gonna have a Patreon. We weren’t gonna do anything. We said, if we can just get 10 people who regularly want to listen, then that’ll be enough because all we wanna do is talk about books. And I actually think that’s the single best decision that we made was to not make it about any sort of result or metric.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:09:32]:

Trick, and in my day job, everything is about profit and all the different KPIs. Right? We love a metric. Yep. Currently Reading was a pure passion play, and that enabled us to make a lot of decisions where we didn’t have to think about some of the things you think about when money is at issue, and I think that made us

John Garrett [00:09:52]:

better. Yeah. It’s just it’s liberating because you’re you’re not playing it so safe. The the guardrails aren’t up because it doesn’t matter. Right. I mean, you know, you’re not Oprah where A 1000000000 people are listening, and, you know, at the beginning. So it’s like, well, let’s just swing for the fences every time. Why not? You know? And then and then it just You’re freer and that comes out.

John Garrett [00:10:12]:

Like, people can hear it, and and I love that. You know? It created that space for you to be able to be That. You know, take the guardrails off and and just be you instead of, you know, in the executive space where, well, you know, a little bit of guardrail helps Bad times.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:10:28]:

Right. And I tend toward not I tend toward. I’m I’m a perfectionist. I’m very I am such a perfectionist. And currently reading gave me the ability just like you said to be like, you know what? Let’s just try it and see what happens, or let me just, on the mic, be exactly who I am. And if people don’t all love who I am on the mic, that’s okay. Yeah. And that has been really helpful to me in kind of pushing out some of those walls around my comfort zone.

John Garrett [00:11:02]:

Yeah. And and that’s such a great point too of of how, you know, the the fear of being who we are at work. You know, we we Leave so many pieces of us outside the office because, well, we this has nothing to do with my job or people aren’t gonna care or what it’s like, no. No. You’re you. The leadership hired you as a human, and there’s other dimensions to you besides the technical skills part, And it’s important for that. And and so as a as a leader of an organization, how much does it matter to you that people have ands, that they you even learn what they are or that they explore them.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:11:39]:

Right. And this is something I think surprises people when they start to work for us. This is something that we definitely want to amplify in all of our employees. This is something like, if we wanna know what people do what they love doing, what lights them up. And if they have something that they wanna take from a hobby to a side hustle, we actually have I actually work with my employees, if that’s something that they wanna do, we encourage hobbies just for the sake of hobbies. But if they want to or what they love outside of work and kind of grow something into a side hustle, I actually work with them 1 on 1. We have a 4 day work week at Here Comes the Guide, so we only work Monday through Thursday? Yeah. And so on Fridays, I oftentimes will be meeting with 1 or the other member of my staff to really talk through how to grow A Side Hustle from Start to Profit.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:12:30]:

Right? And so they’re always surprised that it’s something not only that we’re okay with, but it’s something that we really love because time and time again, you know better than anyone, the people who have hobbies that they really love or things that they’re doing that Sharpen Their Saw, it makes them fresher, more creative, and better at their work for Here Comes the Guide. So I’m all about it with my employees.

John Garrett [00:12:55]:

Yeah. I love that. That’s so awesome. And so do you just ask them, or is it part of the onboarding process or the interviewing process or because, I mean, it is that simple if you just ask, but I know a lot of people listening and they’re like, well, how do you find out?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:13:10]:

Right. Well, there’s 42 of us. It’s 42 women and we have a super flat management structure, so my COO and I actually know every one of our employees really, really well. We spend a lot of time getting to know them and as individuals within our group and within their skill sets within our group, but also, you know, we shoot the s h a lot. Like, we we we really, like I mean, this is something that we take really seriously is the whole ethos around Here Comes the Guide is about being the best version of yourself inside and outside of work. So there’s no, like, work version of Meredith and home version of Meredith. It’s all 1 person and so we think about that. I think about that with everyone who works for me.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:13:55]:

So we get to know each other really well. I have you know, when people find out that I have a book podcast, I will often have people come into my virtual office. We’re fully remote, so we’re we’re all virtual, but they’ll knock on my virtual door and be like, I don’t know what book I should read next, and we’ll spend 30 minutes talking about books. And so I have multiple staffers who have incredible hobbies or side hustles outside of work and we love to talk about it. The other thing is when we have retreats, oftentimes, I like to mix up what we’re working on. I don’t wanna work on here comes the guide work at a retreat because that’s what we do all the time. So sometimes we’ll take some of the side hustle stuff, use it as a creative exercise, and kind of brainstorm together all 42 of us to talk about 1 person’s side hustle and how they can amplify it, and that’s something that we love to do together too.

John Garrett [00:14:46]:

Yeah. And that oh, man. These are such great examples of caring about the person that works for Here Comes the Guide. You know, you hired a person, not an analyst or a marketer or whatever their role is. You hired a human. And, you know, what’s the difference between sending them to technical skills training and the difference to, you know, having a retreat where we pour All of our knowledge into your hobby or, you know, side hustle. We’re making you a better person, and you’re you’re living your best life. You’re gonna do your best work, And you guys are such the example of that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:15:21]:

Working together in different ways, which is what I’m trying to do in a retreat. Right? I’m trying to shake us up. I’m trying to clear our chakras. I’m trying to get us to work together maybe in different groups outside of our normal work groups that we’re in all the time. It’s just a great exercise. I mean, I’m I’m so much more interested in managing a group of people that I wanna hang out with than I am managing a group of people that are just automatons who come into work, clock in for 8 hours and clock

John Garrett [00:15:47]:

out. No. I love it. And they wanna work for someone that cares about them as a person because it’s like, oh, you know, I know you love going to concerts. You went to that concert over the weekend. How was it? You know, show me some pictures. Let’s see the videos, whatever. Because then it’s like, wow.

John Garrett [00:16:00]:

She knows me and not just job title me. That’s incredible. It matters so much.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:16:05]:

I was texting the other day with one of my newer employees, and I was asked it had just occurred to me the last time we talked, she loves plants. And the last time we talked, she had bought a brand new monstera, which are can be really fussy plants. Right? And so I just, out of the blue, texted her. I was like, by the way, what happened with the monstera? And she was telling me, but then she was like, it’s so surreal to get a text from my CEO about my plants in the middle of the day, and I’m like, but I’m so interested in your plant. Like Yeah.

John Garrett [00:16:34]:

Yes. I mean, genuinely. Like, because when she talks about her plant, she’s on I mean, she lights up her eyes and the tone of her voice. Everything’s awesome. And so the more that you’re talking about whatever lights you up, then that energy is gonna come out in your work. Yes. And so why this philosophy at Here Comes the Guide? Did you have a manager before you that was like this or maybe the opposite And you swore to never be like that, or how did this come out?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:17:00]:

You know, I think because for me before I did currently reading, I did in 2008, like, back in the hot and heavy days of blogging. I did a website called Penelope Loves Lists, and it was a blog all about people who were super type a like I am and, like, the type a lifestyle. Right? Uh-huh. And so it it never really went much of anywhere, but what it did do is it gave me a creative outlet that was all mine. Yeah. And so I was so enriched by that experience that I then started talking a lot about this with my colleagues. And, you know, they were seeing me do it, they were cheering me on, and then started doing some of their own things, and it kind of just came from that. And I think it was I think it was really wanting something that was purely creative and very low stakes.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:17:57]:

And then Penelope ended up becoming a lot of what I learned that helped me launch currently

John Garrett [00:18:02]:

reading.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:18:03]:

Yeah. Right, and so then I knew a lot more and I did a lot better the 2nd time, and then currently reading has now grown well beyond what I ever could have expected, but still the core of it is that creativity and doing something really fun, and I take that straight back to Here Comes the Guide. There also is something that more directly, more traditionally has benefited Here Comes the Guide in that in 2020 when we were in the middle because Here Comes the Guide is a website that helps people find their wedding venue. Right? So

John Garrett [00:18:33]:

Yeah.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:18:34]:

We have 65 100 wedding venue clients all over the domestic United States, and then we match couples with those wedding venues. In March of 2020, I don’t know if you heard, but there was a little pandemic get started.

John Garrett [00:18:46]:

Must have just been in Texas. That’s

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:18:48]:

Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. Obviously, the hospitality industry, the wedding industry ground to a halt for a while, right

John Garrett [00:18:56]:

Speaking hammered. Absolutely. To 0. It was amazing.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:19:00]:

This was super scary. Yes. To everybody. Right? And so what I said was, you know what? What we are going to do is, first of all, we’re gonna take care of our venue clients. We’re gonna take care of our couples. That’s the most important thing. But now also what we’re gonna do is we’re gonna find a way to use this time because we never would have had this kind of lull

John Garrett [00:19:22]:

before. Sure.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:19:23]:

Yeah. So we came up with a brand new podcast series, a 10 episode podcast series that was made for our venue clients about helping them use this time to work on their business while they couldn’t work in their business Yeah. And we used all the skills that I had learned from producing a podcast for Currently Reading, and we did it for Here Comes the Guide and packaged it up and gave it to our clients, and it was a huge part of how we were able to love on our venue clients during that time and give them something that was really, really useful. And so that was really impactful to our business, and it came directly because I had the comfort with saying, let’s produce a podcast, and we’ll do 10 episodes, and here’s how we do it, and here’s how we build the website associated with it and here’s how we, you know, RSS out all of that, I could do that because I’d done it with currently reading.

John Garrett [00:20:15]:

Yeah. Because you you exercise that muscle outside of work so many times that then when it’s time to use it at work, it’s like, yeah, let’s just do podcast. And then people are like, wait. You what? And it’s like, yeah. With your 1 arm tied behind your back, you could do it. Exactly. And that’s incredible. That’s awesome.

John Garrett [00:20:30]:

And then too, I mean, you find out, You know, all your people’s ands and and what their some of them wanna make it into a side hustle, which is great. You’re able to help there and the the rest of the team to help with that, and And you ask. I mean, you you just you remember, that’s the plant lady. I wanna ask her about her plant or this is whatever, you know. Like, it’s it’s really that simple, But it just takes, you know, 40 seconds to just be like, hey. Send a quick text. And and the impact on that is is so huge That’s you know, for someone to come back with that’s surreal is it’s like in a good way, which is sad on the state of management in general that this is surreal that someone just asks you about you being human. Right.

John Garrett [00:21:12]:

You know?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:21:12]:

Well, and our hobbies are exactly as you’ve said a 1000000 times, they’re what make us individuals. Right? They’re what make us the individual humans, and there’s nothing that humans want more than to be seen. So what a perfect vehicle to be able to really establish relationship with your employees than to see them in that particular way.

John Garrett [00:21:31]:

And especially because you are fully remote and fully virtual that, you know, then then it’s you have extra intention behind it to make sure that that we’re seeing you because I can’t physically see you on a regular basis.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:21:45]:

One of the fun things that we’ve done at Here Comes the Guide to go back to a question that you asked earlier is that we periodically have all staff get togethers virtually. Right? So we’re on Google Meet, but we’ll have a group of 3 or 4 of us get together and organize whatever we’re gonna do during that time, and what they always do is they’ll pull from what their hobbies are. Right? What they love to do. So we have had, like, group Pilates workouts. We’ve had group HIIT workouts. We’ve had plant tutorial. We’ve had conversations about Bravo TV, various Bravo TV shows. We’ve had so it’s so much fun for the individual staffers to be able to bring that and then have everyone participate in different ways, if we give them a budget to spend on everyone so everyone can participate, it’s so much fun and then we feel as a group like we know that staff are so much better because now we’ve seen them lead a Pilates class or a barre class.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:22:39]:

Now we know intellectually that they do that on their own time, but now we got to see them actually and we’re like, wow. You’re really good. Like, you’re legit with you know? Right? Right? No.

John Garrett [00:22:50]:

It’s it’s for sure. And and even if someone’s not, like, full on legit, they’re alive. Like, they’re they’re super excited about this. And the fact that, like, the people that I work with care enough to ask me to do like, when I did comedy and, you know, doing open mics and stuff, and People that I worked with or around would hear and they would come to the shows, and you’re like, holy cow. This is crazy. Like, this is your free time. Like, you came to this. Like, An open mic comedy is brutal.

John Garrett [00:23:17]:

And so, like, you actually sat through all of this to hear my 5 men. I could’ve done this at the office, you know, but they They came anyway to support and and whatever, and and that means so much, that people

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:23:29]:

care. Did it make you more nervous if people from work were there?

John Garrett [00:23:33]:

Honestly, no. Only because I just felt bad for them because if if some of the other ones, like, that were also at the open mic, I was like, oh, man. This is terrible. Like, I wanna go. Like Great. But now I have to stay because they came. Like, otherwise, I would just Irish exit and just, like, I’m out. Like, I’m just gonna go have a hamburger Or something, Milkshake.

John Garrett [00:23:52]:

But I I was definitely I was just excited that they were there because then it was, like, people that could actually ask for honest feedback where I don’t know anyone else in the audience. But it was more cool. It made me focus more and wanna bring it on a different level than before. But I you know, when you’re doing comedy, I don’t think anything makes you nervous because You’re already doing the hardest thing on the planet. So

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:24:13]:

I was gonna say it’s so brave. It’s so brave.

John Garrett [00:24:16]:

Well, no. I appreciate it. But but I I just love these examples of Of how you you’re running the team and and everyone can do this. It’s not, you know, super hard or complicated or expensive. It just takes a little bit of time and intention and care.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:24:32]:

Well, and people will often say, like, well, doesn’t taking the time to have all 42 of you guys on a Google Meet to do a Pilates class to like, shouldn’t that entire period of time be used for work? And what I always tell them is every single time we grow together as a group, we are more productive and more profitable. So I would put our bottom line up against anybody’s Yeah. Yeah. For pure productivity. And so I just think caring about your employees and seeing them as humans wins the balance sheet every time.

John Garrett [00:25:06]:

I love that so much, and I would 100% agree with you, especially the cost of turnover. That’s stupid expensive. Yes. And people are your greatest asset and the one that people don’t usually invest in at all, And so you’re doing it right. And I and I love to hear that, you know, the bottom line impact is there. So it’s not a make believe Harvard case study kind of thing. It’s legit. Yeah.

John Garrett [00:25:30]:

Yeah. It’s right there. I love that. That’s so awesome. Well, before I wrap this up though, I feel like it’s only fair that we turn the tables And maybe make it since I asked you so many questions at the beginning, we’ll make it the Meredith Monday Schwartz podcast because, obviously, it’s not currently reading. But maybe it will become that. Who knows? You’re the host, so you can ask me whatever you want. I’m in the hot seat.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:25:52]:

Okay. Alright. So just a couple rapid fire ones for you, so Wordle, daily or never?

John Garrett [00:25:59]:

Never. I’ve never done it. I see these things pop up and they got green boxes or I don’t know what. I don’t know how to do it. I don’t even know. So, like, I also don’t have a Mac, so I’m, like, the least cool person on the planet.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:10]:

So then my my next question well, I think I’d know the answer. My next question was Garage Band or Audacity?

John Garrett [00:26:15]:

Oh, Yeah. Audacity.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:17]:

Right. You have no choice on that.

John Garrett [00:26:20]:

PC all the way. Yeah.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:21]:

Exactly. Okay. So when you read, I have to know the answer to the question you asked me. What platform do you read on audiobook, Kindle, print?

John Garrett [00:26:29]:

The traditional book is definitely my favorite. I I’ve grown to appreciate the audiobook now, especially if I’m driving a long distance or on a flight or something like that, but especially the driving or doing a a menial task. Plus, you can, like, 1 and a half speed it on some of the authors, which is great. I would say the the digital book is probably my least one that I that I use. But yeah. I mean, it’s a more traditional book.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:26:58]:

Yeah. I love a print book. Do you know my podcast partner, Katie, who does currently reading with me, she listens to her audiobooks, I’m not kidding you, at 3 times speed.

John Garrett [00:27:08]:

Wow. That’s

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:09]:

impressive. Have you ever heard a book at 3 times feed

John Garrett [00:27:12]:

That’s like the micro machines man when I was a kid. Like, that gets my butt. I’m sure, subconsciously, your brain is getting it, but What?

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:21]:

Well, she says the trick is to move yourself up slowly. Like, you can’t start out there. You have to move yourself up slowly, but I’m a 1.5 girl, a 100%.

John Garrett [00:27:29]:

Yeah. 1.5, maybe 2. There are some authors, you know, where it’s like, alright. Let’s crank this up. Like, did you fall asleep? Or, like, you know, like, what happened? Like, it’s But that’s awesome. Well, very cool. Well, those were super easy.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:40]:

Well, can I ask you one

John Garrett [00:27:41]:

more time? It’s your show. It’s your show. So there you go.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:43]:

Excellent. I like it. Okay. So a lot of people don’t like to answer the question their favorite book of all time because it’s difficult. Right? I got one. Okay.

John Garrett [00:27:50]:

Great. Yeah. So, I would say The War of Art by Steven Pressfield. Hands down, best book ever. Love it so much. And, yeah, such a great book.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:27:59]:

Yeah. If you wanna get things done in your creative life, no question. Okay. So then the question that people are more comfortable with is what’s the last 5 star book that you read?

John Garrett [00:28:11]:

Oh, easily the last 5 star book that I read was Eckhart Tolle, A New Earth. Really good, deep, spiritual kind of book. As I was reading it or actually, I did the audiobook, and that was one where you have to, like, three x because Eckhart’s a little bit of a slow talker. Okay. But it’s one of those where I was like, how does every high school student not have to read this book? Like, it’s so good. It’s just good, and it makes a lot of things make sense. That’s another book that I’d recommend. It’s almost the opposite of The War of Art where it’s, you know, just an easy read and just, you know, micro chapters and whatever Eckhart, this, you know, a new earth is deep, and you you might have to, like, go back and restart the chapter.

John Garrett [00:28:50]:

I found that happening. I was like, hold on. Wait. Let’s reread that.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:28:54]:

Like Well, some of the best books are the ones that demand the most of your

John Garrett [00:28:58]:

attention. Yes. Very much. Because it makes such a big difference. Yeah. Absolutely. I love it. Very good, Meredith.

John Garrett [00:29:03]:

Well, thank you so much for being a part of What’s Your Ann and for just shattering the stereotype of what it means to be a a CEO. So it’s awesome.

Meredith Monday Schwartz [00:29:10]:

Thank you. I loved

John Garrett [00:29:15]:

it. Very cool. And everybody listening, if you wanna see some pictures of Meredith in action tune on her podcast or some of the books she likes to read or connect with her on social media or better yet, get the link to the currently reading podcast, go to what’s your and dot Calm, everything’s there. And while you’re on the page, please click that big button to the anonymous research survey about corporate culture, and don’t forget to check out the book. So thanks again for subscribing on podcast or whatever app you use and for sharing this with your friends so they get the message that we’re all trying to spread, that who you are is so much more than what you